Just for fun... @VegasFrank; is there a difference between an employer not wanting to pay for the pill, and legislating an employee's personal life? It may be apparent to you, but you're assuming motives. (unless not-up-on-the latest-me hasn't seen where Hobby Lobby came right out and said they are trying to control their employees. I don't know) An employee should still be able to obtain the pill, should she wish, yes? Isn't it kind of her responsibility, in the end, to get it somewhere if that's what she wants or needs? Isn't it kind of a stretch to lay the onus on her employer if she gets pregnant, not to mention, has an abortion? Outloud thoughts from someone who is thankful to have never had to make any of these decisions.
Just an unrelated fyi:
A month ago I tried to mail some cigars, reusing a cotm box and was told by the USPS lady it was forbidden to mail tobacco products. Since when is it forbidden to mail tobacco? Since the people in charge deemed tobacco an unfavorable product, although still legal.
Trapped in the People's Communits Republic of Massachusetts.
LOL Well, @VegasFrank , I can't quite equate smoking a joint with beating your wife, but otherwise, yeah.
WARNING: The above post may contain thoughts or ideas known to the State of Caliphornia to cause seething rage, confusion, distemper, nausea, perspiration, sphincter release, or cranial implosion to persons who implicitly trust only one news source, or find themselves at either the left or right political extreme. Proceed at your own risk.
"If you do not read the newspapers you're uninformed. If you do read the newspapers, you're misinformed." -- Mark Twain
@peter4jc said:
Just for fun... @VegasFrank; is there a difference between an employer not wanting to pay for the pill, and legislating an employee's personal life? It may be apparent to you, but you're assuming motives. (unless not-up-on-the latest-me hasn't seen where Hobby Lobby came right out and said they are trying to control their employees. I don't know) An employee should still be able to obtain the pill, should she wish, yes? Isn't it kind of her responsibility, in the end, to get it somewhere if that's what she wants or needs? Isn't it kind of a stretch to lay the onus on her employer if she gets pregnant, not to mention, has an abortion? Outloud thoughts from someone who is thankful to have never had to make any of these decisions.
Local public health has them for $9.00 / month, if you're employed and have a reasonable income. If you don't, they're free. Just sayin'.
WARNING: The above post may contain thoughts or ideas known to the State of Caliphornia to cause seething rage, confusion, distemper, nausea, perspiration, sphincter release, or cranial implosion to persons who implicitly trust only one news source, or find themselves at either the left or right political extreme. Proceed at your own risk.
"If you do not read the newspapers you're uninformed. If you do read the newspapers, you're misinformed." -- Mark Twain
@peter4jc said:
Just for fun... @VegasFrank; is there a difference between an employer not wanting to pay for the pill, and legislating an employee's personal life? It may be apparent to you, but you're assuming motives. (unless not-up-on-the latest-me hasn't seen where Hobby Lobby came right out and said they are trying to control their employees. I don't know) An employee should still be able to obtain the pill, should she wish, yes? Isn't it kind of her responsibility, in the end, to get it somewhere if that's what she wants or needs? Isn't it kind of a stretch to lay the onus on her employer if she gets pregnant, not to mention, has an abortion? Outloud thoughts from someone who is thankful to have never had to make any of these decisions.
Interesting. Hobby lobby owners said that their Christian beliefs and ideals don't allow them to pay for insurance that provides birth control pills because the bible something or other... It was so bad that my ultra lib wife won't go to HL anymore.
"An employee should still be able to obtain the pill, should she wish, yes?
Great theory, but it's a little dicier than that. First of all, people count on their healthcare to pay for healthcare items. Birth control is prescription only, and so you need a prescription to get it. Without your health insurance, it's way more expensive, unaffordable even, if you're paying for it out of pocket.
Let us also not forget that some women use birth control to regulate themselves if you know what I mean. They are not even controlling birth!
Sure, A woman could go down to the free clinic in the middle of the city to get her birth control. But now donors and maybe taxpayers are paying for it. What about those taxpayers who are against birth control? All of a sudden they don't have a say in how public dollars are used because a righteous privately owned company made the decision for everybody, including the woman?
The bottom line is that the woman agreed to a compensation package that included healthcare. Then the employer, not even the insurance company, arbitrarily assigns values and morals to all of its employees and restricts that health benefit with zero compensation dollars, while other employees of other companies with the same insurance carrier get that benefit for the included price. Simultaneously, the insurance industry wants to bellyache about being regulated. America!
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@peter4jc said:
Just for fun... @VegasFrank; is there a difference between an employer not wanting to pay for the pill, and legislating an employee's personal life? It may be apparent to you, but you're assuming motives. (unless not-up-on-the latest-me hasn't seen where Hobby Lobby came right out and said they are trying to control their employees. I don't know) An employee should still be able to obtain the pill, should she wish, yes? Isn't it kind of her responsibility, in the end, to get it somewhere if that's what she wants or needs? Isn't it kind of a stretch to lay the onus on her employer if she gets pregnant, not to mention, has an abortion? Outloud thoughts from someone who is thankful to have never had to make any of these decisions.
Local public health has them for $9.00 / month, if you're employed and have a reasonable income. If you don't, they're free. Just sayin'.
I love how you pivot from pragmatism to principles back to pragmatism. My head is spinning!
Using that logic, it doesn't actually cost hobby lobby any extra money to just provide the damn pills. What's the big deal? Especially when they're going to get it anyways for 9 bucks a month in your town! Pragmatism! bigly!
Maybe we're not using the same logic and all of our arguments? Maybe we are just arguing for the Christian side we believe in? Cool if that's the case. Just own it.
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I'll start keeping a scorecard so we can keep track of all of our beliefs.
We are against private companies restricting the sale and transport of tobacco from Americans because it is not illegal.
We are for Christian companies restricting the distribution of birth control pills from Americans because it is their religious right to restrict them.
We are against having to carry covid-19 cards because it is akin to carrying your papers and **** Germany
We are for having ID checks everywhere and carrying your papers at the polls and with you around generally to prevent our own annihilation from illegal immigrants.
Anything I miss?
Disclaimer: All trolling is provided for the sole entertainment purposes of the author only. Readers may find entertainment and hard core truths, but none are intended. Any resulting damaged feelings or arse chapping of the reader are the sole responsibility of the reader, to include, but not limited to: crying, anger, revenge pørn, and abandonment or deletion of ccom accounts. Offer void in Utah because Utah is terrible.
@VegasFrank said:
I'll start keeping a scorecard so we can keep track of all of our beliefs.
We are against private companies restricting the sale and transport of tobacco from Americans because it is not illegal.
We are for Christian companies restricting the distribution of birth control pills from Americans because it is their religious right to restrict them.
We are against having to carry covid-19 cards because it is akin to carrying your papers and **** Germany
We are for having ID checks everywhere and carrying your papers at the polls and with you around generally to prevent our own annihilation from illegal immigrants.
Anything I miss?
And so you believe certain things, everyone else is wrong?
Comparing covid cards to ID's is apples and oranges.
With an ID you are proving the YOU are the person.
And you are only required to show ID in certain instances.
Having to show a card proving you had the vaccination, I would think is a violation of the HIPAA laws.
Protected Health Information Definition
Under HIPAA, protected health information is considered to be individually identifiable information relating to the past, present, or future health status of an individual that is created, collected, or transmitted, or maintained by a HIPAA-covered entity in relation to the provision of healthcare, payment for healthcare services, or use in healthcare operations (PHI healthcare business uses).
Health information such as diagnoses, treatment information, medical test results, and prescription information are considered protected health information under HIPAA, as are national identification numbers and demographic information such as birth dates, gender, ethnicity, and contact and emergency contact information. PHI relates to physical records, while ePHI is any PHI that is created, stored, transmitted, or received electronically.
In Fumo Pax Money can't buy happiness, but it can buy cigars and that's close enough.
@VegasFrank said:
I'll start keeping a scorecard so we can keep track of all of our beliefs.
We are against private companies restricting the sale and transport of tobacco from Americans because it is not illegal.
We are for Christian companies restricting the distribution of birth control pills from Americans because it is their religious right to restrict them.
We are against having to carry covid-19 cards because it is akin to carrying your papers and **** Germany
We are for having ID checks everywhere and carrying your papers at the polls and with you around generally to prevent our own annihilation from illegal immigrants.
Anything I miss?
And so you believe certain things, everyone else is wrong?
Comparing covid cards to ID's is apples and oranges.
With an ID you are proving the YOU are the person.
And you are only required to show ID in certain instances.
Having to show a card proving you had the vaccination, I would think is a violation of the HIPAA laws.
Protected Health Information Definition
Under HIPAA, protected health information is considered to be individually identifiable information relating to the past, present, or future health status of an individual that is created, collected, or transmitted, or maintained by a HIPAA-covered entity in relation to the provision of healthcare, payment for healthcare services, or use in healthcare operations (PHI healthcare business uses).
Health information such as diagnoses, treatment information, medical test results, and prescription information are considered protected health information under HIPAA, as are national identification numbers and demographic information such as birth dates, gender, ethnicity, and contact and emergency contact information. PHI relates to physical records, while ePHI is any PHI that is created, stored, transmitted, or received electronically.
No, Tony. I didn't say anyone was wrong. Just like last time you said that to me. You're good at telling me what I said. I kind of feel like jack Nicholson in few good men I just wish it was accurate....
I said it was inconsistent and that, to me, is mind numbing. You would only have to show your covid card in certain instances too like high density 0laces such as sporting events, airplane rides, or whatever the hell is deemed high density/risk. Funny, you show your ID and your credit card to get into a sporting event, but don't want to show a covid vaccine card to take off your mask. What vital personal medical information is on that card, pray tell?
Oh, it's just private, but the social security number on my ID is okay to prove I'm not from Guadalajara?
It's inconsistent. You can pretend it's not if you want to, I guess. I won't argue with you, because I wouldn't want to say you're wrong, you know....
Disclaimer: All trolling is provided for the sole entertainment purposes of the author only. Readers may find entertainment and hard core truths, but none are intended. Any resulting damaged feelings or arse chapping of the reader are the sole responsibility of the reader, to include, but not limited to: crying, anger, revenge pørn, and abandonment or deletion of ccom accounts. Offer void in Utah because Utah is terrible.
@VegasFrank said:
I'll start keeping a scorecard so we can keep track of all of our beliefs.
We are against private companies restricting the sale and transport of tobacco from Americans because it is not illegal.
We are for Christian companies restricting the distribution of birth control pills from Americans because it is their religious right to restrict them.
We are against having to carry covid-19 cards because it is akin to carrying your papers and **** Germany
We are for having ID checks everywhere and carrying your papers at the polls and with you around generally to prevent our own annihilation from illegal immigrants.
Anything I miss?
And so you believe certain things, everyone else is wrong?
Comparing covid cards to ID's is apples and oranges.
With an ID you are proving the YOU are the person.
And you are only required to show ID in certain instances.
Having to show a card proving you had the vaccination, I would think is a violation of the HIPAA laws.
Protected Health Information Definition
Under HIPAA, protected health information is considered to be individually identifiable information relating to the past, present, or future health status of an individual that is created, collected, or transmitted, or maintained by a HIPAA-covered entity in relation to the provision of healthcare, payment for healthcare services, or use in healthcare operations (PHI healthcare business uses).
Health information such as diagnoses, treatment information, medical test results, and prescription information are considered protected health information under HIPAA, as are national identification numbers and demographic information such as birth dates, gender, ethnicity, and contact and emergency contact information. PHI relates to physical records, while ePHI is any PHI that is created, stored, transmitted, or received electronically.
No, Tony. I didn't say anyone was wrong. Just like last time you said that to me. You're good at telling me what I said. I kind of feel like jack Nicholson in few good men I just wish it was accurate....
I said it was inconsistent and that, to me, is mind numbing. You would only have to show your covid card in certain instances too like high density 0laces such as sporting events, airplane rides, or whatever the hell is deemed high density/risk. Funny, you show your ID and your credit card to get into a sporting event, but don't want to show a covid vaccine card to take off your mask. What vital personal medical information is on that card, pray tell?
Oh, it's just private, but the social security number on my ID is okay to prove I'm not from Guadalajara?
It's inconsistent. You can pretend it's not if you want to, I guess. I won't argue with you, because I wouldn't want to say you're wrong, you know....
There is no consistency in this country.
If there were, we probably wouldn't be having debates like this.
I don't disagree with you on a lot of points. I just want folks to think.
To look at the information and decide. Most folks do not.
They use their beliefs to make decisions.
Or the beliefs instilled in them by their parents or family.
Folks tend not to look at both sides, so their views are often skewed.
Being part white and part native, I tend to try and stay on the fence, cause once I fall to one side or another, it makes a person biased. Hard to do sometimes.
As for saying a person is wrong. The implication was there in the way it was worded.
You have your beliefs, stand by them and as you said, own them.
If our govt would make laws and then use those laws as worded, we probably wouldn't be in the mess we are. But they don't. They then interpret the laws, as they see fit.
Believing what you do, does not make you wrong, nor does someone else believing something else, make them wrong.
In Fumo Pax Money can't buy happiness, but it can buy cigars and that's close enough.
Yeah okay @0patience there's no consistency in this country. That doesn't or shouldn't give anyone here or anywhere else license to be more inconsistent. That's how a country loses a moral compass. If you want show your papers to vote and show your papers to walk down the street in Tucson and show your papers to do one of a hundred things, them what's wrong with show your papers to get into the stadium?
What's wrong with it, in most cases, is that people don't wanna show the vaccine card because they're not vaccinated and don't want to get vaccinated, but don't want to wear the mask.
See, it's not about the moral of it, it's about the individual situation, and to me it's crap when someone pretends to stand behind principle to do it instead of just saying "I don't want to get it and I don't want to wear my mask."
Maybe you don't think you need the vaccine. Maybe you don't believe in covid, or don't think it's gonna make you safe or think it'll make you unsafe. Fine. But saying that it's your private medical information just ain't true, to use another few good men like. That card has your name, the company of the vaccine, and the date.
I suspect, and here's where's you can take issue with me, that people who want that to be private are mostly those who are refusing vaccines but don't want to admit that fact to the crowd of people that they're with at that time.
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@VegasFrank
You are too easy. LOL!
I've never said I don't wear a mask.
I never said I didn't want to get the vaccine.
I showed reasons why I think there may be issues with having to show a card and you clearly don't like that.
You say you don't say people are wrong, but you imply it.
I take that opportunity to find flaws in it.
Just my nature.
In Fumo Pax Money can't buy happiness, but it can buy cigars and that's close enough.
Of course, tony @0patience. I wasn't talking of you personally, of course. And yes, I imply that a conflicted set of values is flawed, so fair enough. 😁
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“It has been a source of great pain to me to have met with so many among [my] opponents who had not the liberality to distinguish between political and social opposition; who transferred at once to the person, the hatred they bore to his political opinions.” —Thomas Jefferson (1808)
@VegasFrank said: My place of employment is going to decide my morals? Fück that.
Perhaps I'm wrong, but your arguments that come after this seem, well, inconsistent with this sentiment, don't they?
WARNING: The above post may contain thoughts or ideas known to the State of Caliphornia to cause seething rage, confusion, distemper, nausea, perspiration, sphincter release, or cranial implosion to persons who implicitly trust only one news source, or find themselves at either the left or right political extreme. Proceed at your own risk.
"If you do not read the newspapers you're uninformed. If you do read the newspapers, you're misinformed." -- Mark Twain
You tell me @Amos_Umwhat. If so, id be happy to explore.
If hobby lobby said, "were not going to cover your gay spouse because we don't like gays, we are christian" are we all cool with that, too?
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If hobby lobby said, "were not going to cover your gay spouse because we don't like gays, we are christian" are we all cool with that, too?
They don't do that? (just kidding)
I didn't realize the whole "no birth control pill" thing, I'd thought their objections were to sponsoring abortion. Personally? I think they're crazy not to pay for the birth control pills, for the reasons you've given. Abortion is a different thing. Preventing pregnancy and ending pregnancy are not the same.
Here's one for consideration, why is it that so many entities, whether public health, VA, private insurance, whatever are happy to pay for birth control, but refuse to pay for v ia gra? She can do it just for fun, but he can't? There's some real inconsistency, and a healthy dose of sexism thrown in just for laughs.
As for my pivoting from principles to pragmatism, I think perhaps you made an assumption somewhere. I don't think that it's Hobby Lobby's business to tell their insurance carrier how to do their job, just pick a plan. However, if the woman in Peters scenario is stuck with that plan, there's a simple and cheap way to get what you want. Some things do come down to personal responsibility. For instance, if Bradley Manning wants to become Chelsea Manning, I'm fine with that. I just don't want to have to pay for such silliness. That's Bradley/Chelsea's responsibility.
I don't want to have to pay for arms for stupidass warlords all around the globe, either.
It's been said that one of the most amazing aspects of the human being is their ability to simultaneously hold opposing views. I tend to find the irony amusing. Until I'm required to subsidize it.
Two things before I go. First, I wouldn't challenge you on these things if I didn't believe that you, Frank, are somewhat like myself. We don't run from an argument, and we don't get our feelings all hurt just because somebody has a different viewpoint. I appreciate those qualities in you. Second, we may possibly differ here, I'm not sure, but I belong to a small and strange minority. You can change my mind. If someone presents an argument that I see is better than mine, or shows me a better way to do something, I will change my viewpoint or my way of doing things. I add this because many will say "What's the point of these conversations? Nobody ever changes their mind." I do. But, only for effective arguments.
WARNING: The above post may contain thoughts or ideas known to the State of Caliphornia to cause seething rage, confusion, distemper, nausea, perspiration, sphincter release, or cranial implosion to persons who implicitly trust only one news source, or find themselves at either the left or right political extreme. Proceed at your own risk.
"If you do not read the newspapers you're uninformed. If you do read the newspapers, you're misinformed." -- Mark Twain
Ooh, sorry, I glossed over the whole gay spouse part. I don't see it as gay vs. Christian, although many on both sides do. My wife was Episcopalian, they've got gay priests etc. I'm Methodist, we're grappling with that now. I was somewhat conflicted, since several places in the Old and New Testaments speak out against it.
Other than that, my feelings were simply that it doesn't affect me, so I don't care. However, since it has come up on a larger scale in the church, I had to give it some thought. The answers come from our leader, J.C. himself. Love thy neighbor as thyself, forgive your brother 70 times 7, love one another, judge not lest ye be judged. So, while I will not be participating in those actions, I will not stand in your way. Just behave yourself! Lol.
WARNING: The above post may contain thoughts or ideas known to the State of Caliphornia to cause seething rage, confusion, distemper, nausea, perspiration, sphincter release, or cranial implosion to persons who implicitly trust only one news source, or find themselves at either the left or right political extreme. Proceed at your own risk.
"If you do not read the newspapers you're uninformed. If you do read the newspapers, you're misinformed." -- Mark Twain
“It has been a source of great pain to me to have met with so many among [my] opponents who had not the liberality to distinguish between political and social opposition; who transferred at once to the person, the hatred they bore to his political opinions.” —Thomas Jefferson (1808)
“It has been a source of great pain to me to have met with so many among [my] opponents who had not the liberality to distinguish between political and social opposition; who transferred at once to the person, the hatred they bore to his political opinions.” —Thomas Jefferson (1808)
A wave of Afghan military surrenders to the Taliban is picking up speed in rural areas as American troops withdraw.
Thursday, May 27, 2021 10:55 AM EST
Since May 1, at least 26 outposts and bases in just four provinces in Afghanistan have surrendered, according to village elders and government officials. With morale diving as American troops leave, and the Taliban seizing on each surrender as a propaganda victory, each collapse feeds the next.
Comments
Just for fun... @VegasFrank; is there a difference between an employer not wanting to pay for the pill, and legislating an employee's personal life? It may be apparent to you, but you're assuming motives. (unless not-up-on-the latest-me hasn't seen where Hobby Lobby came right out and said they are trying to control their employees. I don't know) An employee should still be able to obtain the pill, should she wish, yes? Isn't it kind of her responsibility, in the end, to get it somewhere if that's what she wants or needs? Isn't it kind of a stretch to lay the onus on her employer if she gets pregnant, not to mention, has an abortion? Outloud thoughts from someone who is thankful to have never had to make any of these decisions.
Just an unrelated fyi:
A month ago I tried to mail some cigars, reusing a cotm box and was told by the USPS lady it was forbidden to mail tobacco products. Since when is it forbidden to mail tobacco? Since the people in charge deemed tobacco an unfavorable product, although still legal.
Trapped in the People's Communits Republic of Massachusetts.
She's misinformed.
SB sends everything priority mail.
LOL Well, @VegasFrank , I can't quite equate smoking a joint with beating your wife, but otherwise, yeah.
"If you do not read the newspapers you're uninformed. If you do read the newspapers, you're misinformed." -- Mark Twain
Local public health has them for $9.00 / month, if you're employed and have a reasonable income. If you don't, they're free. Just sayin'.
"If you do not read the newspapers you're uninformed. If you do read the newspapers, you're misinformed." -- Mark Twain
Interesting. Hobby lobby owners said that their Christian beliefs and ideals don't allow them to pay for insurance that provides birth control pills because the bible something or other... It was so bad that my ultra lib wife won't go to HL anymore.
"An employee should still be able to obtain the pill, should she wish, yes?
Great theory, but it's a little dicier than that. First of all, people count on their healthcare to pay for healthcare items. Birth control is prescription only, and so you need a prescription to get it. Without your health insurance, it's way more expensive, unaffordable even, if you're paying for it out of pocket.
Let us also not forget that some women use birth control to regulate themselves if you know what I mean. They are not even controlling birth!
Sure, A woman could go down to the free clinic in the middle of the city to get her birth control. But now donors and maybe taxpayers are paying for it. What about those taxpayers who are against birth control? All of a sudden they don't have a say in how public dollars are used because a righteous privately owned company made the decision for everybody, including the woman?
The bottom line is that the woman agreed to a compensation package that included healthcare. Then the employer, not even the insurance company, arbitrarily assigns values and morals to all of its employees and restricts that health benefit with zero compensation dollars, while other employees of other companies with the same insurance carrier get that benefit for the included price. Simultaneously, the insurance industry wants to bellyache about being regulated. America!
I love how you pivot from pragmatism to principles back to pragmatism. My head is spinning!
Using that logic, it doesn't actually cost hobby lobby any extra money to just provide the damn pills. What's the big deal? Especially when they're going to get it anyways for 9 bucks a month in your town! Pragmatism! bigly!
Maybe we're not using the same logic and all of our arguments? Maybe we are just arguing for the Christian side we believe in? Cool if that's the case. Just own it.
I'll start keeping a scorecard so we can keep track of all of our beliefs.
Anything I miss?
And so you believe certain things, everyone else is wrong?
Comparing covid cards to ID's is apples and oranges.
With an ID you are proving the YOU are the person.
And you are only required to show ID in certain instances.
Having to show a card proving you had the vaccination, I would think is a violation of the HIPAA laws.
Money can't buy happiness, but it can buy cigars and that's close enough.
No, Tony. I didn't say anyone was wrong. Just like last time you said that to me. You're good at telling me what I said. I kind of feel like jack Nicholson in few good men I just wish it was accurate....
I said it was inconsistent and that, to me, is mind numbing. You would only have to show your covid card in certain instances too like high density 0laces such as sporting events, airplane rides, or whatever the hell is deemed high density/risk. Funny, you show your ID and your credit card to get into a sporting event, but don't want to show a covid vaccine card to take off your mask. What vital personal medical information is on that card, pray tell?
Oh, it's just private, but the social security number on my ID is okay to prove I'm not from Guadalajara?
It's inconsistent. You can pretend it's not if you want to, I guess. I won't argue with you, because I wouldn't want to say you're wrong, you know....
There is no consistency in this country.
If there were, we probably wouldn't be having debates like this.
I don't disagree with you on a lot of points. I just want folks to think.
To look at the information and decide. Most folks do not.
They use their beliefs to make decisions.
Or the beliefs instilled in them by their parents or family.
Folks tend not to look at both sides, so their views are often skewed.
Being part white and part native, I tend to try and stay on the fence, cause once I fall to one side or another, it makes a person biased. Hard to do sometimes.
As for saying a person is wrong. The implication was there in the way it was worded.
You have your beliefs, stand by them and as you said, own them.
If our govt would make laws and then use those laws as worded, we probably wouldn't be in the mess we are. But they don't. They then interpret the laws, as they see fit.
Believing what you do, does not make you wrong, nor does someone else believing something else, make them wrong.
Money can't buy happiness, but it can buy cigars and that's close enough.
Yeah okay @0patience there's no consistency in this country. That doesn't or shouldn't give anyone here or anywhere else license to be more inconsistent. That's how a country loses a moral compass. If you want show your papers to vote and show your papers to walk down the street in Tucson and show your papers to do one of a hundred things, them what's wrong with show your papers to get into the stadium?
What's wrong with it, in most cases, is that people don't wanna show the vaccine card because they're not vaccinated and don't want to get vaccinated, but don't want to wear the mask.
See, it's not about the moral of it, it's about the individual situation, and to me it's crap when someone pretends to stand behind principle to do it instead of just saying "I don't want to get it and I don't want to wear my mask."
Maybe you don't think you need the vaccine. Maybe you don't believe in covid, or don't think it's gonna make you safe or think it'll make you unsafe. Fine. But saying that it's your private medical information just ain't true, to use another few good men like. That card has your name, the company of the vaccine, and the date.
I suspect, and here's where's you can take issue with me, that people who want that to be private are mostly those who are refusing vaccines but don't want to admit that fact to the crowd of people that they're with at that time.
@VegasFrank
You are too easy. LOL!
I've never said I don't wear a mask.
I never said I didn't want to get the vaccine.
I showed reasons why I think there may be issues with having to show a card and you clearly don't like that.
You say you don't say people are wrong, but you imply it.
I take that opportunity to find flaws in it.
Just my nature.
Money can't buy happiness, but it can buy cigars and that's close enough.
Of course, tony @0patience. I wasn't talking of you personally, of course. And yes, I imply that a conflicted set of values is flawed, so fair enough. 😁
a lot of people are uncomfortable with uncertainty, it causes huge problems for a society. Gotta nail everything down in its place. Life is uncertain.
I'll gladly show a vaccine card as soon as you need ID to vote nationally. Even though it's a violation of my privacy.
Don't let the wife know what you spend on guns, ammo or cigars.
A compromise!
I know, You're a big dog and I'm on the list.
Let's eat, GrandMa. / Let's eat GrandMa. -- Punctuation saves lives
It'll be fine once the swelling goes down.
Guard Dooty
Perhaps I'm wrong, but your arguments that come after this seem, well, inconsistent with this sentiment, don't they?
"If you do not read the newspapers you're uninformed. If you do read the newspapers, you're misinformed." -- Mark Twain
You tell me @Amos_Umwhat. If so, id be happy to explore.
If hobby lobby said, "were not going to cover your gay spouse because we don't like gays, we are christian" are we all cool with that, too?
They don't do that? (just kidding)
I didn't realize the whole "no birth control pill" thing, I'd thought their objections were to sponsoring abortion. Personally? I think they're crazy not to pay for the birth control pills, for the reasons you've given. Abortion is a different thing. Preventing pregnancy and ending pregnancy are not the same.
Here's one for consideration, why is it that so many entities, whether public health, VA, private insurance, whatever are happy to pay for birth control, but refuse to pay for v ia gra? She can do it just for fun, but he can't? There's some real inconsistency, and a healthy dose of sexism thrown in just for laughs.
As for my pivoting from principles to pragmatism, I think perhaps you made an assumption somewhere. I don't think that it's Hobby Lobby's business to tell their insurance carrier how to do their job, just pick a plan. However, if the woman in Peters scenario is stuck with that plan, there's a simple and cheap way to get what you want. Some things do come down to personal responsibility. For instance, if Bradley Manning wants to become Chelsea Manning, I'm fine with that. I just don't want to have to pay for such silliness. That's Bradley/Chelsea's responsibility.
I don't want to have to pay for arms for stupidass warlords all around the globe, either.
It's been said that one of the most amazing aspects of the human being is their ability to simultaneously hold opposing views. I tend to find the irony amusing. Until I'm required to subsidize it.
Two things before I go. First, I wouldn't challenge you on these things if I didn't believe that you, Frank, are somewhat like myself. We don't run from an argument, and we don't get our feelings all hurt just because somebody has a different viewpoint. I appreciate those qualities in you. Second, we may possibly differ here, I'm not sure, but I belong to a small and strange minority. You can change my mind. If someone presents an argument that I see is better than mine, or shows me a better way to do something, I will change my viewpoint or my way of doing things. I add this because many will say "What's the point of these conversations? Nobody ever changes their mind." I do. But, only for effective arguments.
"If you do not read the newspapers you're uninformed. If you do read the newspapers, you're misinformed." -- Mark Twain
Ooh, sorry, I glossed over the whole gay spouse part. I don't see it as gay vs. Christian, although many on both sides do. My wife was Episcopalian, they've got gay priests etc. I'm Methodist, we're grappling with that now. I was somewhat conflicted, since several places in the Old and New Testaments speak out against it.
Other than that, my feelings were simply that it doesn't affect me, so I don't care. However, since it has come up on a larger scale in the church, I had to give it some thought. The answers come from our leader, J.C. himself. Love thy neighbor as thyself, forgive your brother 70 times 7, love one another, judge not lest ye be judged. So, while I will not be participating in those actions, I will not stand in your way. Just behave yourself! Lol.
"If you do not read the newspapers you're uninformed. If you do read the newspapers, you're misinformed." -- Mark Twain
Are you a lookist?
gee, I didn't see that coming....
BREAKING NEWS
A wave of Afghan military surrenders to the Taliban is picking up speed in rural areas as American troops withdraw.
Thursday, May 27, 2021 10:55 AM EST
Since May 1, at least 26 outposts and bases in just four provinces in Afghanistan have surrendered, according to village elders and government officials. With morale diving as American troops leave, and the Taliban seizing on each surrender as a propaganda victory, each collapse feeds the next.
Pull our troops out and bomb the snot out of the entire country. We lost a lot of good people there for nothing.
Trapped in the People's Communits Republic of Massachusetts.
So we have an autopilot vehicle that you still have to pilot.
And now, they are going to monitor the driver?
Kind of defeats the purpose?
Tesla Activates In-Car Cameras for Driver Monitoring on Autopilot
https://www.thedrive.com/news/40828/tesla-activates-in-car-cameras-for-driver-monitoring-on-autopilot
Money can't buy happiness, but it can buy cigars and that's close enough.
and they make great pets!
https://my-antics.com/