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Embargo

zoom6zoomzoom6zoom Posts: 1,214 ✭
in General Discussion
This was posted on a non-cigar board today that I frequent:

"I don't see why the US allows imports from China (aren't they communist?) but you can't buy a Cuban cigar (commies too last time I checked)."

Somehow that fact escaped me until now. So how can the cigar embargo be justified? Discuss.

Comments

  • rwheelwrightrwheelwright Posts: 3,296 ✭
    I think it had something to do with how the government came to power and the Cuban Missile Crisis.
  • Dude LoveDude Love Posts: 315
    Because China is our "favorite child". There is no logical reason for the embargo to continue.
  • urbinourbino Posts: 4,517 ✭
    Originally, probably because Cuba is right there, just south of our continental ****, while China is half a world away. Monroe Doctrine and all that.

    Frankly, though, the main reason it remains in force is the existence of a sizable, extremely anti-Castro population in a key presidential battleground state (the aforesaid continental ****).
  • j0z3rj0z3r Posts: 9,403 ✭✭
    Ahem...not one domino shall fall.
  • phobicsquirrelphobicsquirrel Posts: 7,347 ✭✭✭
    Like most things in "govt" or politics nothing makes sense.....
  • LukoLuko Posts: 2,003 ✭✭
    urbino:
    Originally, probably because Cuba is right there, just south of our continental ****, while China is half a world away. Monroe Doctrine and all that.

    Frankly, though, the main reason it remains in force is the existence of a sizable, extremely anti-Castro population in a key presidential battleground state (the aforesaid continental ****).
    Ha, Florida is like a big fat peepee, huh?
  • urbinourbino Posts: 4,517 ✭
    It's always seemed so to me.
  • kuzi16kuzi16 Posts: 14,633 ✭✭✭✭
    rwheelwright:
    I think it had something to do with how the government came to power and the Cuban Missile Crisis.
    i htink this is right. that and china is now leaning more and more capitalist.
    Kuzi's Forum Links Page
  • PuroFreakPuroFreak Posts: 4,131 ✭✭
    kuzi16:
    rwheelwright:
    I think it had something to do with how the government came to power and the Cuban Missile Crisis.
    i htink this is right. that and china is now leaning more and more capitalist.
    I'm going to have to agree with this this statement, but go on to say that the embargo has long out lived its usefulness. It was a good idea at the time with them allowing Russia to park Nukes at our back door, but now, we trade with Russia, China, and every other Communist nation around pretty much. It is well beyond time to end the embargo, open up trade lines with Cuba, and help boost BOTH of our economies. Lets face it, Cuba is one country where we have a good chance to export a lot more than we import. Cigars and sugar are about the only major things we would be importing, but could export tons of goods and services.

    But as Pheebs pointed out, it's government... It doesn't and never will make any sense..
  • KriegKrieg Posts: 5,188 ✭✭✭
    In the most recent edition of Cigar Aficionado, they have an article about the Cuban embargo. Basically, they are talking about how Obama wants to start opening up relations with Cuba. Now I am not saying I am an avid Obama supporter, but I do agree with lifting the Cuban embargo, it has been in place for over 50years, it's time to try something else.

    "Long ashes my friends."

  • havanaalhavanaal Posts: 155 ✭✭
    Who is the Embargo actually helping? The Cuban people? Not! Us? No way! Until someone can answer that question there is no sense to it. The argument that it lends support to anti-Castro sentiment in Cuba may be true, but no one can say it's been an effective tactic. That being said, if the Embargo were lifted, would it affect the cigar trade in a big way? Sure, Cubanos would be available to us, but at what price? And haven't European concerns monopolized the Cuban cigar industry?
  • mmaggimmaggi Posts: 9
    I have quite a few Cuban friends who came over to the states when they were children over 35 years ago. They believe the embargo hurts the Cuban people more than the government. I have spoken to them about their recent trips back to visit family and let me tell you, the stories bring tears to your eyes. The majority of the Cuban people are poverty stricken and struggle day to day. That said, I'm not sure why the embargo is still in place. Don't know when it will be lifted and if someone does know when it will be lifted, I have a Mega-Millions lottery sheet I need your help to fill out. :-)
  • rwheelwrightrwheelwright Posts: 3,296 ✭
    mmaggi:
    I have quite a few Cuban friends who came over to the states when they were children over 35 years ago. They believe the embargo hurts the Cuban people more than the government. I have spoken to them about their recent trips back to visit family and let me tell you, the stories bring tears to your eyes. The majority of the Cuban people are poverty stricken and struggle day to day. That said, I'm not sure why the embargo is still in place. Don't know when it will be lifted and if someone does know when it will be lifted, I have a Mega-Millions lottery sheet I need your help to fill out. :-)
    I don't think that lifting it will help the Cuban people. It is the government that is supressing them and not us.
  • rwheelwrightrwheelwright Posts: 3,296 ✭
    havanaal:
    Who is the Embargo actually helping? The Cuban people? Not! Us? No way! Until someone can answer that question there is no sense to it. The argument that it lends support to anti-Castro sentiment in Cuba may be true, but no one can say it's been an effective tactic. That being said, if the Embargo were lifted, would it affect the cigar trade in a big way? Sure, Cubanos would be available to us, but at what price? And haven't European concerns monopolized the Cuban cigar industry?
    Someone made an interesting point to me a while ago. IF the embargo ends and cuban cigars are now available in the US the quality of the cigars will likely diminish. By opening up the US market for cubans, it is doubtful that the cuban companies will be able to provide quality cigars while procuing the amount that would be needed for US consumption. Increase in production would decrease quality overall until new warehouses were opened, more tobacco fields were planted and new workers were trained.
  • kuzi16kuzi16 Posts: 14,633 ✭✭✭✭
    rwheelwright:
    mmaggi:
    I have quite a few Cuban friends who came over to the states when they were children over 35 years ago. They believe the embargo hurts the Cuban people more than the government. I have spoken to them about their recent trips back to visit family and let me tell you, the stories bring tears to your eyes. The majority of the Cuban people are poverty stricken and struggle day to day. That said, I'm not sure why the embargo is still in place. Don't know when it will be lifted and if someone does know when it will be lifted, I have a Mega-Millions lottery sheet I need your help to fill out. :-)
    I don't think that lifting it will help the Cuban people. It is the government that is supressing them and not us.
    agreed. Cuba does business with the rest of the world. not having us in the mix doesnt seem to be hurting other countries that dont deal with us. Im assuming we had an embargo with Russia during the cold war. that wasnt stopping them from being a superpower. If i recall correctly it was their socialist nature that put them under. ...same thing with cuba. In fact every socialist country has a very poor and oppressed population; nature of the beast. China is turning that around as we speak with Capitalism.
    Kuzi's Forum Links Page
  • rwheelwrightrwheelwright Posts: 3,296 ✭
    kuzi16:
    rwheelwright:
    mmaggi:
    I have quite a few Cuban friends who came over to the states when they were children over 35 years ago. They believe the embargo hurts the Cuban people more than the government. I have spoken to them about their recent trips back to visit family and let me tell you, the stories bring tears to your eyes. The majority of the Cuban people are poverty stricken and struggle day to day. That said, I'm not sure why the embargo is still in place. Don't know when it will be lifted and if someone does know when it will be lifted, I have a Mega-Millions lottery sheet I need your help to fill out. :-)
    I don't think that lifting it will help the Cuban people. It is the government that is supressing them and not us.
    agreed. Cuba does business with the rest of the world. not having us in the mix doesnt seem to be hurting other countries that dont deal with us. Im assuming we had an embargo with Russia during the cold war. that wasnt stopping them from being a superpower. If i recall correctly it was their socialist nature that put them under. ...same thing with cuba. In fact every socialist country has a very poor and oppressed population; nature of the beast. China is turning that around as we speak with Capitalism.
    As we are moving to a socialist govenment.
  • urbinourbino Posts: 4,517 ✭
    kuzi16:
    In fact every socialist country has a very poor and oppressed population; nature of the beast.
    Well, except just about every country in western Europe, all of which are socialist, according to the definition of that word that's being thrown around in America these days.
  • PuroFreakPuroFreak Posts: 4,131 ✭✭
    urbino:
    kuzi16:
    In fact every socialist country has a very poor and oppressed population; nature of the beast.
    Well, except just about every country in western Europe, all of which are socialist, according to the definition of that word that's being thrown around in America these days.
    You mean besides Ireland and Scotland right?
  • kuzi16kuzi16 Posts: 14,633 ✭✭✭✭
    they are more socialist than the US is. they also havent had as robust an economy as the US has had for several decades now either. they arent 100% socialist, but they do lean that way. and their government is oppressive and very bigbrotheresque, with cameras on every street corner and what not
    Kuzi's Forum Links Page
  • PuroFreakPuroFreak Posts: 4,131 ✭✭
    Exactly, Ireland and Scotland are both socialist countries and both have had weak economies. Ireland is REALLY in the crapper and has been for a while. If you study their economy you can really see how the socialist policies have hurt productivity and caused worker moral to plunge.
  • smbrinksmbrink Posts: 406 ✭
    Wow just imagine it...the day the embargo is lifted, im sure our good friends at ccom will celebrate by having a big fat cuban cigar sale. *drools*
  • jihiggsjihiggs Posts: 469 ✭✭
    the worst thing that could happen is the introduction of american pop culture, although to the majority it is very appealing, but it is poison. interesting how it bears a striking similarity to sin?
  • urbinourbino Posts: 4,517 ✭
    Ireland and Scotland are having problems, but they are neither poor nor oppressed. Countries like Sweden, Denmark, Norway, France, etc., are all extremely prosperous, have higher standards of living than we do, are healthier than we are, according to all surveys are happier than we are, and yet all of them have been social democratic countries for decades.

    I don't need to defend the notion that there aren't poor and oppressed socialist countries; I never made such a statement. The statement made here was:
    kuzi16:
    In fact every socialist country has a very poor and oppressed population; nature of the beast.
    That is simply false -- under the definition of socialism getting thrown around by the American right these days.
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