Sniper's Gripe Thread
The Sniper
Posts: 3,910 ✭
OK gentlemen, enough is enough and I'm tired of it.
I just read on another thread that two more BOTL got screwed over on trades. Tried their best to make it right thru PM's and couldn't get it done. Both have refused to name the offending parties.
A lot of people don't want to make waves. Or Dont like conflict. Don't want to be seen as the guy who "flamed" somebody in the open forum.
I myself have no such qualms or concerns.
Some folks simply dont like conflict or drama, and I can understand that also. To a point. But at some point, when you've done everything you can do to work a situation out and its not happening, PEOPLE NEED TO KNOW ABOUT IT. And they need to know more than "I got screwed." They need to know who and how - not necessarily to flame the person, but to protect your fellow BOTL so they don't end up the same way you did. Ive been there - got hosed on a trade, said nothing, and then found out that the offending party ran the same scam on other BOTL here. A LOT of others.
Part of that was my fault, because I said nothing to warn and protect others. Its a sick feeling fellas, it really is. And I decided then and there that I wasn't going to let it happen again.
Said all that to say this - Im going to put myself in the kill box. If you have a bad deal with somebody, I want to know about it. See something hinky happening in a pass? Screwed on a trade? See someone acting like a jacka$$ in a thread? TELL ME. Shoot me a pm and let me know the details of whats going on. And here's what I'm going to do with it...
First, Im going to contact the person(s) involved and try to mediate or moderate the situation. Ive found in life there are three sides to most stories - yours, mine, and the truth somewhere between the two of them. If I get a gripe about someone, I want to hear what that someone has to say about it.
After that, Im going to contact several senior BOTL who are to the best of my knowledge neutral to the situation in question. I will get their thoughts on the situation, act accordingly, and pm the parties involved to let them know what that action is.
This is not meant to be a unilateral action gentlemen. I am not going to be judge, jury & executioner all by my little lonesome. However, I AM going to protect the members of this forum, and maintain the integrity of the forums, to the utmost.
I've gotten a ton of pm's over the last several months to the effects of "the forums just aren't like they used to be", and "I cant believe the nerve of such-and-such", and "somebody should say something", and "you're a highly respected member of the forums (debatable I know), people will listen to you". Ive also seen lots of inferences to bad trades, passes, etc but nobody seems to really address the issue directly or do anything about any of this.
So I,m gonna try.
In closing, got a b*tch, gripe or complaint? PM me and let me try to help or take care of it for you. Comments on anything I post here are encouraged, but please Please PLEASE PM me with any initial issue and let me try this system out to see how it works, instead of using this thread to just flame someone or post veiled references to the issue. Let's see how it goes.
My fellow BOTL, the complaint line is OPEN. PM me.
I just read on another thread that two more BOTL got screwed over on trades. Tried their best to make it right thru PM's and couldn't get it done. Both have refused to name the offending parties.
A lot of people don't want to make waves. Or Dont like conflict. Don't want to be seen as the guy who "flamed" somebody in the open forum.
I myself have no such qualms or concerns.
Some folks simply dont like conflict or drama, and I can understand that also. To a point. But at some point, when you've done everything you can do to work a situation out and its not happening, PEOPLE NEED TO KNOW ABOUT IT. And they need to know more than "I got screwed." They need to know who and how - not necessarily to flame the person, but to protect your fellow BOTL so they don't end up the same way you did. Ive been there - got hosed on a trade, said nothing, and then found out that the offending party ran the same scam on other BOTL here. A LOT of others.
Part of that was my fault, because I said nothing to warn and protect others. Its a sick feeling fellas, it really is. And I decided then and there that I wasn't going to let it happen again.
Said all that to say this - Im going to put myself in the kill box. If you have a bad deal with somebody, I want to know about it. See something hinky happening in a pass? Screwed on a trade? See someone acting like a jacka$$ in a thread? TELL ME. Shoot me a pm and let me know the details of whats going on. And here's what I'm going to do with it...
First, Im going to contact the person(s) involved and try to mediate or moderate the situation. Ive found in life there are three sides to most stories - yours, mine, and the truth somewhere between the two of them. If I get a gripe about someone, I want to hear what that someone has to say about it.
After that, Im going to contact several senior BOTL who are to the best of my knowledge neutral to the situation in question. I will get their thoughts on the situation, act accordingly, and pm the parties involved to let them know what that action is.
This is not meant to be a unilateral action gentlemen. I am not going to be judge, jury & executioner all by my little lonesome. However, I AM going to protect the members of this forum, and maintain the integrity of the forums, to the utmost.
I've gotten a ton of pm's over the last several months to the effects of "the forums just aren't like they used to be", and "I cant believe the nerve of such-and-such", and "somebody should say something", and "you're a highly respected member of the forums (debatable I know), people will listen to you". Ive also seen lots of inferences to bad trades, passes, etc but nobody seems to really address the issue directly or do anything about any of this.
So I,m gonna try.
In closing, got a b*tch, gripe or complaint? PM me and let me try to help or take care of it for you. Comments on anything I post here are encouraged, but please Please PLEASE PM me with any initial issue and let me try this system out to see how it works, instead of using this thread to just flame someone or post veiled references to the issue. Let's see how it goes.
My fellow BOTL, the complaint line is OPEN. PM me.
0
Comments
Thanks, Glen. You da man.....
Oh, and nicely done. If you need a deputy...lol
It was a long time after he had been a member of the forums when I had my first dealing with JoeyJoe. We agreed on a trade, and it did NOT go smoothly. Replies were slow in coming, delays on his end such as "can you wait for my end until payday", etc, etc. When I finally DID receive his end of the trade, it did NOT contain the sticks we had agreed upon, which led to more "My bad dude, I'll make it right" type excuses.
By this point, I had had a stomach full of the whole thing, told him to just keep the sticks in question and called it a day. Like a bunch of people around here would and do, I just filed the incident away in the "CAUTION" folder in my brain, and didnt post anything about the incident.
Fast forward several months. Redtailhawkoz posts up one day that he got screwed over in an outside-the-forums purchase by none other than JoeyJoe. Remember, up to this point, JoeyJoe still had a solid rep on the forums, so this post by Oz was NOT received well. Old boy got HAMMERED, partially due to the fact that Oz being Oz (bless his heart) didnt post it as "I had something happen over the weekend, and here are the details", instead going the route of "THIS ******'N ***** ***** DELIBERATELY *****D ME IN MY *** AND IF HE DID IT TO ME HE'LL DO IT TO YOU TOO!!!" route.
Unfortunately, a good number of us heard the tone but missed the message.
Sometime around all this, I got a pm from a close friend on the forums along the lines of "Dude, I had a trade with this guy, the sticks were not the ones we agreed on and my end was short. What should I do?"
My reply - "Let me guess - JoeyJoe?"
His next pm - "How the he11 did you know?"
After that, we started snooping around and it was sort of like the old Prell commercial - we knew two friends who had similar experiences with JoeyJoe, and THEY knew two friends, and THOSE TWO knew two friends..." You get the picture.
And the funny part - up to this point, NOBODY HAD SAID A WORD about any of it on the forum. Except Oz screaming from the top of the mountain. :-)
It also came to light around this time that apprently JoeyJoe's SECOND collection of Cigars For Troops, which was donated to even heavier than the first one, apparently never MADE IT to the troops. Not a single delivery confirmation number, no proof of shipping, no photos of happy troops puffing away, nothing.
Most of which could have been avoided or minimized had even a few of those of us who got shafted said something publicly like Ozzie did (although maybe in more of a PC format LOL).
Hence the thought process behind this thread.
- Remember the Golden Rule and treat others as you would have them treat you. We call each other brothers and sisters of the leaf. By this, we mean regarding each other as family thru a shared love of cigars and treating each other accordingly, NOT beating each other up as siblings often do. ;-)
- When getting involved with someone's game or pass, play by THEIR rules. If you dont like the rules of the game or pass, dont get involved. If you CHOOSE to get involved, dont gripe or try to adjust the situation to your liking - its disruptive and more importantly, disrespectful to the person who started it. When YOU start the game or pass, THEN its your show and you can do as you please.
- Think before you type, then re-read before you post. ESPECIALLY when you're PO'd about something. If you choose not to do this, expect a backlash and dont get butthurt when it comes.
- Got bad stuff happening outside the forums? DO come here and tell us about it, vent, rage against the dying of the light, ask if folks can help you out. We are your extended family and are here for you, and most folks here will do whatever they can to help you in any way they can. On the flip side of that coin, DO NOT come here and allow your rage and frustrations to cause you to use other forum members as your emotional punching bag.
Sniper OUT
"Long ashes my friends."
ROTFLMAO! I have been absent pretty much allot here latley, so TOnight, I had time to Roll through the Forum and read alot of Good and Not so good stuff, and see that there are ALLOT of NEW people on here I have never heard of (whick I was one of those guys once) then I thought I would check out to see if the there was still some Tiitiees and Beer on the Hotties thread ! ROTFLMAO
and I fall onto this Thread !
NICE !!!!!!!!!!! I was about to add my 2 cents about the Ole Joey Joe deal but see there is no need! What both Glen and I found interesting was the Magnitude of BAD DEALS there were out there with this Guy, anyway I wont dig that crrap up again, KARMA IS A ***! LOL anyway, Thanks for the LOVE Glen....
P.S. I have always found the Direct Honest LOUD Appproach to get the most attenttion..... Can make amends later if need be! LOL I Miss you Guys!
During the whole episode with Joey I remember thinking "oh, there goes Ozzie being a grump", I didn't know what was going on and when I found out how bad it was I felt like an ass for not listening to you. I guess that whole thing taught me two lessons, one was to be more vigilant and the other was to look past the words and see the message. You've been a voice of reason on many occasions...even if you do come off as a mad man screaming atop a mountain.