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So how many of you think that the United States should attack Iran? I know the pro Israelite mob is pushing for this as is Romney but why? Polls show Americans don't want it and really we can't afford it. I mean both for money and life of our soldiers, hell they have been stretched so thin. Also why do we need to be an Empire? I mean our own borders need major work. I mean at the rate things are going we don't need a atomic bomb to hit our cities, we are already destroying them.
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Comments

  • RainRain Posts: 8,960 ✭✭✭
    It would, in my opinion, be the end of the world. Make no mistake, Iran has nukes.
  • jthanatosjthanatos Posts: 1,570 ✭✭
    I think it is a terrible idea to attack Iran. If for no other reason than the one thing the middle east needs right now is MORE instability...
  • Gray4linesGray4lines KentuckyPosts: 4,503 ✭✭✭✭✭
    You say we can't afford it, but Keynesian economists might say another war is just the thing our economy needs. Demand is demand, whether it's for guns or goods.
    LLA - Lancero Lovers of America
  • phobicsquirrelphobicsquirrel Posts: 7,349
    Gray4lines:
    You say we can't afford it, but Keynesian economists might say another war is just the thing our economy needs. Demand is demand, whether it's for guns or goods.
    true
  • fla-gypsyfla-gypsy Posts: 3,024 ✭✭
    Maybe we should just wait for them to attack us. Let me add to this discussion. If Iran attacks Israel, should we get involved?
  • beatnicbeatnic Posts: 4,133
    I haven't hear Romney say he wants to bomb Iran. Where did that come from? Now, Israel may want to. And they would probably like US backing because they used to consider us an ally. But I haven't heard any politician say we should. Saying they support Israel doesn't mean we support them bombing Iran. However, the Iranians have said multiple times, by Imams and the Ahmadinnerjacket guy, that as soon as they have an atomic bomb, they will bomb Israel. Do you believe them?
  • fla-gypsyfla-gypsy Posts: 3,024 ✭✭
    I have no doubt they will at some point probably when we show some wavering of support for Israel that Ahmidinnerjacket (LOL, thanks for that one) will carry out his often announced intentions of anihilating Israel particularry if he can get other Arab thiefdoms to help him. History tells us it will happen again just as it did in 67 and 73 but this time it will go nuclear
  • kuzi16kuzi16 Posts: 14,616 ✭✭✭✭
    Rain:
    It would, in my opinion, be the end of the world. Make no mistake, Iran has nukes.
    if they had them they would have used them already.
  • RainRain Posts: 8,960 ✭✭✭
    kuzi16:
    Rain:
    It would, in my opinion, be the end of the world. Make no mistake, Iran has nukes.
    if they had them they would have used them already.
    There is no way you can prove this point. Most Countries that have nukes have never used them (minus testing). You don't think any nukes made it out of Russia during the 90s? Suitcase bombs? However, nor can I prove that Iran does indeed have nukes :)
  • JDHJDH Posts: 2,107
    fla-gypsy:
    Maybe we should just wait for them to attack us. Let me add to this discussion. If Iran attacks Israel, should we get involved?
    "...Maybe we should just wait for them to attack us. ..." Yes. Exactly. We should not attack any country until they have attacked us. Precisely right. "...If Iran attacks Israel, should we get involved?..." Is Israel part of the United States? They are an Ally, without question. If Israel is attacked, and they ask for our aid, I am positive that it will be provided.
  • kuzi16kuzi16 Posts: 14,616 ✭✭✭✭
    Rain:
    kuzi16:
    Rain:
    It would, in my opinion, be the end of the world. Make no mistake, Iran has nukes.
    if they had them they would have used them already.
    There is no way you can prove this point. Most Countries that have nukes have never used them (minus testing). You don't think any nukes made it out of Russia during the 90s? Suitcase bombs? However, nor can I prove that Iran does indeed have nukes :)
    given the mentality of their leader, id say its a safe bet. He would be at least flashing them around like "look what i got!!"

    not only that, but they have yet to have a test of any. im sure we have tons of satellites pointed at those guys. we would know.

    i feel we should stay out of it. yeah, Ahmadinejad is a nut job, but he has yet to cross the line. as soon as he does (and what the line actually is), then its a different ball game.

  • The_KidThe_Kid Posts: 7,871 ✭✭✭
    fla-gypsy:
    I have no doubt they will at some point probably when we show some wavering of support for Israel that Ahmidinnerjacket (LOL, thanks for that one) will carry out his often announced intentions of anihilating Israel particularry if he can get other Arab thiefdoms to help him. History tells us it will happen again just as it did in 67 and 73 but this time it will go nuclear
    I believe the Israeli's will strike first in a premptive attack, Iran has probably developed the capability of enriching uranium to weapons grade but they lack a substantial delivery system, we will not let them develop their weapons program to where they can deliver an ICBM. Isreal will do what they have to do
  • rzamanrzaman Posts: 2,650 ✭✭✭

    The war is going on for many years. There have been at least 15 attempts to sabotage Iran's nuclear plants. However, the effectiveness is questionable. Israel will never take the risk to attack Iran unless there is a nod from the US. In reality, US learned the lesson from Iraq war without enough evidence. I would say it is easy to say things but very difficult to do in action. The risk is high, Iran indeed has huge influence all over Middle-East. On top of that if Israel had the ability and political(which is more important than military power) support they would have done that long time ago. In fact, they have been trying that many years. The best Israel can do is a shadow war or in other term sabotage. Israel does has some nukes but nuke is like a expensive toy, you can talk about it, play with it but cannot use it in real life. This is not 1945 this is 2012- the world has changed so much. Noone will forgive the nation who will use nuke first. This is the reason why Israel wants our politicians to say something because it is easier to deal with such a touchy issue during the election period.

    The other issue is economic. Iran hold huge reserve of oil so does the region. No industrialized nation will take the hit, specially during the on-going economic crunch. Iran understands their geo-political advantage very well. On top of that all the emerging economies still buy oil from Iran through a bilateral currency deal instead of US$ so they can bypass US Financial institution. India, China and Brazil will not take the risk and sacrifice their own economy. US has been loosing a lot for the bilateral currency deal.

    I believe, as a nation, we need to prioritize our national interest first. Haven't we paid enough for others interest? My take on this issue is, time has come to find the answer
  • LukoLuko Posts: 2,004
    Didn't our special forces turn the lights out on two Iranian facilities within the last week or so? Maybe I'm naive, but I have full faith in our military's ability to make Iran look like Wiley Coyote at any time our choosing, without leaving so much as a track on the ground. Iamadinnerjacket's 15 minutes is just about over.
  • bigfnstevebigfnsteve Posts: 1,435 ✭✭✭
    Isreal attacked Iraq and set back it`s nuclear program awhile back. Iraq under Saddam Hussain was also hated by the Arabs .
    I think its a very good chance that Isreal has to launch a raid. They will have to. Chamberlain can`t be replayed. It would be a sad day if we did not support them.
    If Columbia hated the US, threatened us daily and was creating the ability to deliver nuclear weapons would the US not take preemptive action?
    I know we didn`t invade Cuba in the 60s but we went about as far as we could without pure aggression obviously we were not dealing with religious fanatics either
    I think that it is a scary situation all the way around. The Iranian population is somewhat secular and westernised in comparison to many countries in the region. Sanctions are taking a toll. I hope that the people decide to build from the demonstrations in 09? And take things further prior to the completion of any form of weapon. Hell I don`t know. Its all f#&&#d up
  • bigfnstevebigfnsteve Posts: 1,435 ✭✭✭
    Dupes
  • Amos_UmwhatAmos_Umwhat West TNPosts: 5,188 ✭✭✭✭✭
    JDH:
    fla-gypsy:
    Maybe we should just wait for them to attack us. Let me add to this discussion. If Iran attacks Israel, should we get involved?
    "...Maybe we should just wait for them to attack us. ..." Yes. Exactly. We should not attack any country until they have attacked us. Precisely right. "...If Iran attacks Israel, should we get involved?..." Is Israel part of the United States? They are an Ally, without question. If Israel is attacked, and they ask for our aid, I am positive that it will be provided.
    Right here with JDH.
    Maybe we should "attack" some of our own problems.
    Hmm, I'm fairly pro-Israel, if Iran attacks them, I say let's wipe out Iran, if it's the other way, not so sure.
    .
    WARNING:  The above post may contain thoughts or ideas known to the State of Caliphornia to cause seething rage, confusion, distemper, nausea, perspiration, sphincter release, or cranial implosion to persons who implicitly trust only one news source, or find themselves at either the left or right political extreme.  Proceed at your own risk.  

    "There is nothing so in need of reforming as someone else's bad habits."   Mark Twain
  • fla-gypsyfla-gypsy Posts: 3,024 ✭✭
    I have to say that the Iranian leader Imadiinerjacket is a hoot and keeps the Drudgereport well supplied with material. I wonder sometimes if some of these countries understand the true destructive capability possessed by the US military, heck I'm not sure I understand the destructive capability of the conventional and nuclear weapons that can be delivered by our military in an all out assault
  • JDHJDH Posts: 2,107
    fla-gypsy:
    I have to say that the Iranian leader Imadiinerjacket is a hoot and keeps the Drudgereport well supplied with material. I wonder sometimes if some of these countries understand the true destructive capability possessed by the US military, heck I'm not sure I understand the destructive capability of the conventional and nuclear weapons that can be delivered by our military in an all out assault
    ...and I pray to God that we never find out what that destructive capability is.
  • raisindotraisindot BostonPosts: 1,308 ✭✭✭
    beatnic:
    I haven't hear Romney say he wants to bomb Iran. Where did that come from? Now, Israel may want to. And they would probably like US backing because they used to consider us an ally. But I haven't heard any politician say we should. Saying they support Israel doesn't mean we support them bombing Iran. However, the Iranians have said multiple times, by Imams and the Ahmadinnerjacket guy, that as soon as they have an atomic bomb, they will bomb Israel. Do you believe them?
    Actually, Iran has never said it would nuke Israel (and I'm Jewish, and pro-Israel, but not rabidly so), nor has it said it wold unilaterally attack Israel. It wants everyone else to do so, of course, but then again what middle eastern country doesn't want Israel destroyed? Iran has never even admitted it is pursuing nuclear weapons (although it is quite obvious they are). As much as I despise Iran, I don't think a nuclear Iran would risk nuking Israel, which has at least 20-100 nukes and would totally obliterate every last inch of Iran if Iran tried it. Even the crazy nations (North Korea, Pakistan) that have far more advanced nuclear capabilities than Iran haven't seriously threatened to launch nukes at their enemies. Balance of terror is still an effective deterrent, although if any of Iran's nukes gets in the hands of their terrorist clients that's a whole new ball game. Personally, much as I'd like to see the current government of Iran wiped away, I'm not in favor of either Israel or the U.S. attacking it. I just don't think carpet bombing will do any damage to Iran's nuclear sites--they're too well buried underground of dispersed in civilian areas. I'd be much more in favor or CIA or Mossad agents infiltrating these facilities and sabotaging them from within. Now, if Iran tries to close down the Persian Gulf to shipping, then that's another story--the U.S. Navy should wipe Iran's flotilla down to the last rowboat. It would probably take about five minutes.
  • VulchorVulchor FloridaPosts: 4,806 ✭✭✭
    To answer the question by Pheebs bluntly, I am against action in Iran. To answer Gypsy, I am also against assisting Isreal unilaterally and without first being asked.
  • phobicsquirrelphobicsquirrel Posts: 7,349
    beatnic:
    I haven't hear Romney say he wants to bomb Iran. Where did that come from? Now, Israel may want to. And they would probably like US backing because they used to consider us an ally. But I haven't heard any politician say we should. Saying they support Israel doesn't mean we support them bombing Iran. However, the Iranians have said multiple times, by Imams and the Ahmadinnerjacket guy, that as soon as they have an atomic bomb, they will bomb Israel. Do you believe them?


    http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2012/09/18/romney-wants-to-attack-iran-to-prevent-a-dirty-bomb.html

    http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/07/29/romney-would-back-israeli-strike-against-iran-senior-adviser-says/

    He even mentioned it in his acceptance speech. The party wants another war. During the whole debate a few months ago the right was blasting obama for not saying he would but while they were quibbling the Joint Chiefs were against a military attack. Just like Iraq, the GOP have no idea how to run a war.
  • beatnicbeatnic Posts: 4,133
    phobicsquirrel:
    beatnic:
    I haven't hear Romney say he wants to bomb Iran. Where did that come from? Now, Israel may want to. And they would probably like US backing because they used to consider us an ally. But I haven't heard any politician say we should. Saying they support Israel doesn't mean we support them bombing Iran. However, the Iranians have said multiple times, by Imams and the Ahmadinnerjacket guy, that as soon as they have an atomic bomb, they will bomb Israel. Do you believe them?


    http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2012/09/18/romney-wants-to-attack-iran-to-prevent-a-dirty-bomb.html

    http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/07/29/romney-would-back-israeli-strike-against-iran-senior-adviser-says/

    He even mentioned it in his acceptance speech. The party wants another war. During the whole debate a few months ago the right was blasting obama for not saying he would but while they were quibbling the Joint Chiefs were against a military attack. Just like Iraq, the GOP have no idea how to run a war.


    I'm sorry. Nothing in his speech stated that he wanted to start a war or bomb Iran.
    If I were Iran, if I were Iran—a crazed fanatic, I'd say let's get a little fissile material to Hezbollah, have them carry it to Chicago or some other place, and then if anything goes wrong, or America starts acting up, we'll just say, "Guess what? Unless you stand down, why, we're going to let off a dirty bomb." I mean this is where we have—where America could be held up and blackmailed by Iran, by the mullahs, by crazy people. So we really don't have any option but to keep Iran from having a nuclear weapon.

    "Make no mistake, the ayatollahs in Iran are testing our moral defenses,” Romney said. "They want to know who will object and who will look the other way. We will not look away nor will our country ever look away from our passion and commitment to Israel. … We recognize Israel's right to defend itself." He also declared Jerusalem the capital of Israel.
    Earlier in the day, top foreign policy adviser Dan Senor in a preview of the speech suggested Romney would support Israel making a military strike on Iran to defend itself against a nuclear-capable Tehran. “Gov. Romney believes we should employ any and all measures to dissuade the Iranian regime from its nuclear course, and it is his fervent hope that diplomatic and economic measures will do so,” Senor said. “In the final analysis, of course, no option should be excluded.”
    I'm amazed you read this that way. I suspect you figured out our magic code words. LMAO. Instead of creating a scenario in your mind as to what you think Romney means, listed to his words. But, I guess that reading the liberal take on things you just assume everybody lies when they speak.
  • phobicsquirrelphobicsquirrel Posts: 7,349
    Well believe what you want but the right have made a lot of noise about not using the military on Iran. That party has had a hard on for war for some time. Homeland Security, TSA uses as of now, Iraq, Afghanistan and the huge flux of private security firms being used in combat areas. Make no mistake, they want war, they even lied their **** off to get into Iraq.
  • phobicsquirrelphobicsquirrel Posts: 7,349
    fla-gypsy:
    Maybe we should just wait for them to attack us. Let me add to this discussion. If Iran attacks Israel, should we get involved?
    No. We should only get involved if the rest of the UN and Security council does. Iran is a hornets nest. Russia and China wouldn't let them get taken out easily. So what if Iran gets a nuke. China has them, Russia has them. Going to war would be bad, and if Israel wants to attack them, they should do it, but it's on them. They talk tuff but only due to the US. I really think their own issues need to be resolved with all the senseless killing they have and are doing.
  • phobicsquirrelphobicsquirrel Posts: 7,349
    beatnic:
    phobicsquirrel:
    beatnic:
    I haven't hear Romney say he wants to bomb Iran. Where did that come from? Now, Israel may want to. And they would probably like US backing because they used to consider us an ally. But I haven't heard any politician say we should. Saying they support Israel doesn't mean we support them bombing Iran. However, the Iranians have said multiple times, by Imams and the Ahmadinnerjacket guy, that as soon as they have an atomic bomb, they will bomb Israel. Do you believe them?


    http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2012/09/18/romney-wants-to-attack-iran-to-prevent-a-dirty-bomb.html

    http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/07/29/romney-would-back-israeli-strike-against-iran-senior-adviser-says/

    He even mentioned it in his acceptance speech. The party wants another war. During the whole debate a few months ago the right was blasting obama for not saying he would but while they were quibbling the Joint Chiefs were against a military attack. Just like Iraq, the GOP have no idea how to run a war.


    I'm sorry. Nothing in his speech stated that he wanted to start a war or bomb Iran.
    If I were Iran, if I were Iran—a crazed fanatic, I'd say let's get a little fissile material to Hezbollah, have them carry it to Chicago or some other place, and then if anything goes wrong, or America starts acting up, we'll just say, "Guess what? Unless you stand down, why, we're going to let off a dirty bomb." I mean this is where we have—where America could be held up and blackmailed by Iran, by the mullahs, by crazy people. So we really don't have any option but to keep Iran from having a nuclear weapon.
    Then when you sign up and go into combat let us know if you feel the same way. Most people who I know who have been in war (especially veitnam and these new ones) they don't like it. Some do, that's fine the military IC likes sheep, works well.
  • Amos_UmwhatAmos_Umwhat West TNPosts: 5,188 ✭✭✭✭✭
    If I'm not mistaken, Romney told an interviewer last spring that one of the first things he'd do as President is get us back into Iraq. He lost me right then, forever.

    I don't think anyone should put too much stock in Ahmedinijad (sp?) spouting off about destroying Israel, that's just stock talk for Arab / Muslim politicians. Kind of like Republicans saying they're for "freedom". They don't mean your freedom, or mine, just CEO's and Hedge-Fund managers and such. I mean, they had both houses of congress, the presidency, and the majority of the Supreme Court, and all they did was get both cloven hoofs in the trough and pig out.

    Or Democrats raising taxes "for the children", while decade after decade the schools fall apart.

    It's all baloney.

    Bring our troops, our dollars, and our technology home. Only do business with governments that are demonstrably fair with their people. Kick the living **** out of anyone who screws with us, leave them in shambles except for necessary (food, not guns) aid to their peoples. Last but not least, repeal the Facist "Patriot Act" and get back to the Constitutional Democracy we've been trying to become for the last 230 years or so.

    Rant over, sorry fellas, sometimes I just can't help it.
    .
    WARNING:  The above post may contain thoughts or ideas known to the State of Caliphornia to cause seething rage, confusion, distemper, nausea, perspiration, sphincter release, or cranial implosion to persons who implicitly trust only one news source, or find themselves at either the left or right political extreme.  Proceed at your own risk.  

    "There is nothing so in need of reforming as someone else's bad habits."   Mark Twain
  • Amos_UmwhatAmos_Umwhat West TNPosts: 5,188 ✭✭✭✭✭
    fla-gypsy:
    I have to say that the Iranian leader Imadiinerjacket is a hoot and keeps the Drudgereport well supplied with material. I wonder sometimes if some of these countries understand the true destructive capability possessed by the US military, heck I'm not sure I understand the destructive capability of the conventional and nuclear weapons that can be delivered by our military in an all out assault
    He is hilarious to listen to, I must admit. What a moron.
    WARNING:  The above post may contain thoughts or ideas known to the State of Caliphornia to cause seething rage, confusion, distemper, nausea, perspiration, sphincter release, or cranial implosion to persons who implicitly trust only one news source, or find themselves at either the left or right political extreme.  Proceed at your own risk.  

    "There is nothing so in need of reforming as someone else's bad habits."   Mark Twain
  • beatnicbeatnic Posts: 4,133
    phobicsquirrel:
    beatnic:
    phobicsquirrel:
    beatnic:
    I haven't hear Romney say he wants to bomb Iran. Where did that come from? Now, Israel may want to. And they would probably like US backing because they used to consider us an ally. But I haven't heard any politician say we should. Saying they support Israel doesn't mean we support them bombing Iran. However, the Iranians have said multiple times, by Imams and the Ahmadinnerjacket guy, that as soon as they have an atomic bomb, they will bomb Israel. Do you believe them?


    http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2012/09/18/romney-wants-to-attack-iran-to-prevent-a-dirty-bomb.html

    http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/07/29/romney-would-back-israeli-strike-against-iran-senior-adviser-says/

    He even mentioned it in his acceptance speech. The party wants another war. During the whole debate a few months ago the right was blasting obama for not saying he would but while they were quibbling the Joint Chiefs were against a military attack. Just like Iraq, the GOP have no idea how to run a war.


    I'm sorry. Nothing in his speech stated that he wanted to start a war or bomb Iran.
    If I were Iran, if I were Iran—a crazed fanatic, I'd say let's get a little fissile material to Hezbollah, have them carry it to Chicago or some other place, and then if anything goes wrong, or America starts acting up, we'll just say, "Guess what? Unless you stand down, why, we're going to let off a dirty bomb." I mean this is where we have—where America could be held up and blackmailed by Iran, by the mullahs, by crazy people. So we really don't have any option but to keep Iran from having a nuclear weapon.
    Then when you sign up and go into combat let us know if you feel the same way. Most people who I know who have been in war (especially veitnam and these new ones) they don't like it. Some do, that's fine the military IC likes sheep, works well.
    What the heck does that have to do with this conversation? We have an all volunteer service. For Vietnam, people were drafted against their will. Now, they know what they're signing up for. You still haven't acknowledged that Romney never said he wanted to bomb Iran. You just changed the subject.
  • fla-gypsyfla-gypsy Posts: 3,024 ✭✭
    I have read quotes from Imadinnerjacket that he intends to "eliminate", "remove", "wipe clean" Isreal. I don't think he has the kahonies to mess with them for real. Each time some of Isreal's "peace loving" neighbors attack them they always seem worse off afterward and run to the UN to try to get their territory back. Phobic's world view is entertaining to me I guess because I have never known many liberals. They are not very plentiful in north Florida. We happily to cling to our guns and Bibles, you know the type.
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