William Larue Weller Bourbon----1 bottle

Vulchor

So a friend of mine works at a liquor store and was able to secure me one bottle of the W.L Weller 2012 bourbon if I want it. They jack up the price of course, so it is more than MSRP, but cheaper than alot of sites I have seen. As funds are tight right now, and Im into the gin and J.Walker lately, I sadly have to pass. But I wanted to throw this option out to you guys as I know this is hard to get and someone may be happy to jump on this. PM me if you are interested and I can provide details.

jasonusa1

You have a pm.

JDH

Thanks for putting this up, and I've got to admit that it tempted the hell out of me, but, there are so many good bourbons here in central KY, and more than quite a few great bourbons readily avaliable at reasonable prices that I'll let this one slide by.......but if it was Pappys.........that's a 'nuther story!

jthanatos

This year's Weller is pretty fantastic.... I should save my money though... oh what the hell, you have a pm.

Rob1110

I usually steer clear of shooting down opinions but Pappy really is over-hyped, over-rated and over-priced. Every time I have a friend who asks about the "world famous, Pappy 23 that everyone talks about like it's liquid gold," I hand them some 23, Vintage 17 year Bourbon and a few of the Parker's Reserves and Pappy ALWAYS comes in LAST. This has happened multiple times and Pappy was the priciest bottle. Sorry, just gotta rant about that. There's better out there and for much less.

JDH

Rob1110:

I usually steer clear of shooting down opinions but Pappy really is over-hyped, over-rated and over-priced. Every time I have a friend who asks about the "world famous, Pappy 23 that everyone talks about like it's liquid gold," I hand them some 23, Vintage 17 year Bourbon and a few of the Parker's Reserves and Pappy ALWAYS comes in LAST. This has happened multiple times and Pappy was the priciest bottle. Sorry, just gotta rant about that. There's better out there and for much less.

Taste is subjective - that's why there's so many different whiskies, wines, and cigars. I won't disagree that it's overpriced, and I won't disagree there are probably better out there at lower prices, but it all depends on what you like and how much you like it. When people start running down ANY expensive whiskey or wine, or cigar, I usually just suggest that THEY avoid it, but don't expect others to follow suit.

jthanatos

Rob1110:

I usually steer clear of shooting down opinions but Pappy really is over-hyped, over-rated and over-priced. Every time I have a friend who asks about the "world famous, Pappy 23 that everyone talks about like it's liquid gold," I hand them some 23, Vintage 17 year Bourbon and a few of the Parker's Reserves and Pappy ALWAYS comes in LAST. This has happened multiple times and Pappy was the priciest bottle. Sorry, just gotta rant about that. There's better out there and for much less.

I agree to a point. For a few year's Pappy swept a bunch of awards, and has ingrained itself as the 'Holy Grail' of whiskey. To be honest, most people I know usually prefer the 15 and 20 to the 23 and if you can find them at MSRP (before the crazy speculative buying in the last few years) they sit pretty even with most of the Parker's Heritage I have had. The hard thing with annual releases is some years they are fantastic, some years not so much. There have been some greeeeat releases of Pappy. There have been some awwwwful releases of Parker's. Same with BT's antiques, and Ardbeg stuff, and Woodford's Master collection, and every other annual release. ... but at the end of the day, I still want to try them all.

On a side note, big +1 on Vintage Bourbon making some great stuff while generally flying under the radar.

Rob1110

I agree that taste is subjective and I will be avoiding Pappy in the future. While I don't expect everyone to follow my opinion and I'm not saying it's a horrible whiskey, just not worth the money or hype. I also hope people educate themselves on the Pappy brand. They have never actually owned their own distillery. They have always been proprietors, so to speak. They buy barrels of Bourbon off of other distilleries and when they feel they are ready, they bottle them up and slap a label on them. They have finally just recently admitted this and that the world famous "23" isn't actually 23 year old Bourbon. But for $200 minimum, who's counting?

I also agree on trying everything out there. If I hadn't spent the money on Pappy, I wouldn't know it's not worth the money. Same goes for the Parker's being well worth the money. And that Vintage 17 year, I NEVER expected that kind of quality out of a bottle under $70. That stuff is fantastic. Love their other expressions as well - Noah's Mill, Black Maple Hill and Rowan's Creek are all awesome stuff.

jthanatos

Rob1110:

They have finally just recently admitted this and that the world famous "23" isn't actually 23 year old Bourbon. But for $200 minimum, who's counting?

Where did you see this? I know they are moving to Buffalo Trace as their main wheated source now that Stitzel-Weller is running out, but I haven't seen anything about it not being of a proper age. I have also seen where there was the big kerfuffle over Harlen Wheatley's sourcing comments awhile back, but that was mainly sourcing and changes in flavor profiles as far as I am aware.

Vulchor

Bottle is gone fellas.

Rob1110

This was relayed to me by a very knowledgeable source at a local shop. He was pretty disappointed to hear it as well. From everything I've heard and read, the brand is going downhill in attempting to keep up with demand and there's still not enough. Either way, they don't produce their own product and are sourcing it from different catalogs, which must make it very inconsistent.

JDH

Rob1110:

This was relayed to me by a very knowledgeable source at a local shop. He was pretty disappointed to hear it as well. From everything I've heard and read, the brand is going downhill in attempting to keep up with demand and there's still not enough. Either way, they don't produce their own product and are sourcing it from different catalogs, which must make it very inconsistent.

I hate to say it, but that sounds like unconfirmed hearsay to me.

jasonusa1

JDH:

Rob1110:

This was relayed to me by a very knowledgeable source at a local shop. He was pretty disappointed to hear it as well. From everything I've heard and read, the brand is going downhill in attempting to keep up with demand and there's still not enough. Either way, they don't produce their own product and are sourcing it from different catalogs, which must make it very inconsistent.

I hate to say it, but that sounds like unconfirmed hearsay to me.

If I'm not mistaken this is partly correct. Previously, the van winkles purchased the unused Stitzel-Weller stock and that is what was used for pappy 15,20, and 23. Now that they are out of that stock with the 15 and 20yr, and if I'm not mistaken this is the last year of SW juice in the 23yr, everything is being distiller at/by buffalo trace. But really, only the van winkles really know what is what; either way, it's still good stuff.

JDH

Rob1110:

I agree that taste is subjective and I will be avoiding Pappy in the future. While I don't expect everyone to follow my opinion and I'm not saying it's a horrible whiskey, just not worth the money or hype. I also hope people educate themselves on the Pappy brand. They have never actually owned their own distillery. They have always been proprietors, so to speak. They buy barrels of Bourbon off of other distilleries and when they feel they are ready, they bottle them up and slap a label on them. They have finally just recently admitted this and that the world famous "23" isn't actually 23 year old Bourbon. But for $200 minimum, who's counting?

I also agree on trying everything out there. If I hadn't spent the money on Pappy, I wouldn't know it's not worth the money. Same goes for the Parker's being well worth the money. And that Vintage 17 year, I NEVER expected that kind of quality out of a bottle under $70. That stuff is fantastic. Love their other expressions as well - Noah's Mill, Black Maple Hill and Rowan's Creek are all awesome stuff.

"...And that Vintage 17 year, I NEVER expected that kind of quality out of a bottle under $70."...That got me to thinking. I've had Pogue and Willett, and enjoyed them both, (thought Pogue was remarkable) but I've not had Vintage 17. My liquor cabinet is running out of room, but this weekend I'll pick some of this up.

Rob1110

Never seen Pogue around these parts. Gonna have to see if they distribute around here and demand my local shop get some in. If you're giving it a "remarkable," I wanna try it. Gotta Love Willett. Awesome packaging, awesome Bourbon, even better price!

JDH

http://www.bourbonenthusiast.com/forum/DBvd.php?id=22&task=displaybottling

These are some pretty fair reviews of the Pouge. My "problem" is that there's just too many good bourbons avaliable to me in central KY, and I've pretty much settled on three or four that I keep all the time, and a few others that I will buy when they are avaliable. While I've had and enjoyed both Pouge and Willett, I prefer these bourbons: Woodford Reserve, Elijah Craig 18 , Russels Reserve, Eagle Rare, 4 Roses single barrel, and Ri (when avaliable, btw, it's a Rye Whiskey, not a bourbon, but I like this stuff, it's a good mixer. http://www.drinkspirits.com/whiskey/ri1-rye-whiskey/ ) That's just the way my tastes roll.

One thing I can say for sure, the next time I go to Bardstown, I'll stop in at the Willett distillery. Usually we just spend a lot of time at Heaven Hill. I appreciate you pointing out the Vintage 17. Thanks.

jthanatos

jasonusa1:

JDH:

Rob1110:

This was relayed to me by a very knowledgeable source at a local shop. He was pretty disappointed to hear it as well. From everything I've heard and read, the brand is going downhill in attempting to keep up with demand and there's still not enough. Either way, they don't produce their own product and are sourcing it from different catalogs, which must make it very inconsistent.

I hate to say it, but that sounds like unconfirmed hearsay to me.

If I'm not mistaken this is partly correct. Previously, the van winkles purchased the unused Stitzel-Weller stock and that is what was used for pappy 15,20, and 23. Now that they are out of that stock with the 15 and 20yr, and if I'm not mistaken this is the last year of SW juice in the 23yr, everything is being distiller at/by buffalo trace. But really, only the van winkles really know what is what; either way, it's still good stuff.

This got me interested, I was aware of the upcoming switch to BT, but wanted to see if I could find where the underaged statements came from. Doing some digging I found that Harlen Wheatley had made some comments about upcoming Pappy Releases that caused quite a stir, especially when years of production weren't matching up with ages and the content of the bottles didn't seem to be the same as what the Van Winkles claimed. Some of this confusion seemed to come from misunderstanding of when casks are chosen, as in there are most likely casks currently aging that are already being earmarked as possible Pappy in 3,5,10 years. The Whisky Advocate's Chuck Cowdery then did an interview of Julian Van Winkle and Buffalo Trace to clear things up about what is and is not in those crazy pricy bottles (a little more info and clarification of statements is down in the comments, comment 12). He confirmed that as Stitzel-Weller casks run dry they will be blended with and eventually replaced by Buffalo Trace wheated stock. He also confirmed what many of us could probably already guess, just because a bottle is of the 2012 release doesn't mean it was bottled in 2012. Different releases just reflect different flavor profiles, and some years you will get three or four winners, some years will be full of losers. As such, they may bottle releases for a few years in advance. At the moment, all Pappy 23 should be 100% Stitzel-Weller for at least a few more years.

Long story short Harlen Wheatley made some comments regarding his work on Pappy which were taken out of context and over speculated on by a bunch of Whiskey Geeks (us whiskey geeks are worse rumor mongers than a church knitting circle, I swear) and it looks like your friend missed the clarification. Which is pretty normal, scandals are fun to spread online, but I really had to hunt to find the clarification on this issue.

Either way, $200 is a lot to pay for whiskey, even very good whiskey. I still agree 100% that there are better and cheaper whiskeys.... but I still want a bottle of everything.

JDH:

My "problem" is that there's just too many good bourbons avaliable to me in central KY, and I've pretty much settled on three or four that I keep all the time, and a few others that I will buy when they are avaliable. While I've had and enjoyed both Pouge and Willett, I prefer these bourbons: Woodford Reserve, Elijah Craig 18 , Russels Reserve, Eagle Rare, 4 Roses single barrel, and Ri (when avaliable, btw, it's a Rye Whiskey, not a bourbon, but I like this stuff, it's a good mixer. http://www.drinkspirits.com/whiskey/ri1-rye-whiskey/ ) That's just the way my tastes roll.

I want to have your 'problem'....

jasonusa1

jthanatos:

He also confirmed what many of us could probably already guess, just because a bottle is of the 2012 release doesn't mean it was bottled in 2012.

This is true. If you actually have a bottle on hand, towards the bottom most likely on the back, you will find a laser code inscription that will actually tell you when it was bottled. It would be something like: 1215212:32 - and would translate to: first two digits is the year, next three is the day of the year, and the final bit is the time.

JDH

jthanatos:

jasonusa1:

JDH:

Rob1110:

This was relayed to me by a very knowledgeable source at a local shop. He was pretty disappointed to hear it as well. From everything I've heard and read, the brand is going downhill in attempting to keep up with demand and there's still not enough. Either way, they don't produce their own product and are sourcing it from different catalogs, which must make it very inconsistent.

I hate to say it, but that sounds like unconfirmed hearsay to me.

If I'm not mistaken this is partly correct. Previously, the van winkles purchased the unused Stitzel-Weller stock and that is what was used for pappy 15,20, and 23. Now that they are out of that stock with the 15 and 20yr, and if I'm not mistaken this is the last year of SW juice in the 23yr, everything is being distiller at/by buffalo trace. But really, only the van winkles really know what is what; either way, it's still good stuff.

This got me interested, I was aware of the upcoming switch to BT, but wanted to see if I could find where the underaged statements came from. Doing some digging I found that Harlen Wheatley had made some comments about upcoming Pappy Releases that caused quite a stir, especially when years of production weren't matching up with ages and the content of the bottles didn't seem to be the same as what the Van Winkles claimed. Some of this confusion seemed to come from misunderstanding of when casks are chosen, as in there are most likely casks currently aging that are already being earmarked as possible Pappy in 3,5,10 years. The Whisky Advocate's Chuck Cowdery then did an interview of Julian Van Winkle and Buffalo Trace to clear things up about what is and is not in those crazy pricy bottles (a little more info and clarification of statements is down in the comments, comment 12). He confirmed that as Stitzel-Weller casks run dry they will be blended with and eventually replaced by Buffalo Trace wheated stock. He also confirmed what many of us could probably already guess, just because a bottle is of the 2012 release doesn't mean it was bottled in 2012. Different releases just reflect different flavor profiles, and some years you will get three or four winners, some years will be full of losers. As such, they may bottle releases for a few years in advance. At the moment, all Pappy 23 should be 100% Stitzel-Weller for at least a few more years.

Long story short Harlen Wheatley made some comments regarding his work on Pappy which were taken out of context and over speculated on by a bunch of Whiskey Geeks (us whiskey geeks are worse rumor mongers than a church knitting circle, I swear) and it looks like your friend missed the clarification. Which is pretty normal, scandals are fun to spread online, but I really had to hunt to find the clarification on this issue.

Either way, $200 is a lot to pay for whiskey, even very good whiskey. I still agree 100% that there are better and cheaper whiskeys.... but I still want a bottle of everything.

JDH:

My "problem" is that there's just too many good bourbons avaliable to me in central KY, and I've pretty much settled on three or four that I keep all the time, and a few others that I will buy when they are avaliable. While I've had and enjoyed both Pouge and Willett, I prefer these bourbons: Woodford Reserve, Elijah Craig 18 , Russels Reserve, Eagle Rare, 4 Roses single barrel, and Ri (when avaliable, btw, it's a Rye Whiskey, not a bourbon, but I like this stuff, it's a good mixer. http://www.drinkspirits.com/whiskey/ri1-rye-whiskey/ ) That's just the way my tastes roll.

I want to have your 'problem'....

I have it from a very reliable source that Willett is releasing a 21 year bourbon, possibly this week. It should retail just above $150.00 for 750 ml

Rob1110

JDH:

I have it from a very reliable source that Willett is releasing a 21 year bourbon, possibly this week. It should retail just above $150.00 for 750 ml

That, I might have to try.

jthanatos

JDH:

I have it from a very reliable source that Willett is releasing a 21 year bourbon, possibly this week. It should retail just above $150.00 for 750 ml

Is this in addition to their 21 single barrel cask strength that various stores carry? I have seen a few stores with their own picks of those from anywhere between $120 and $220. As in, are they actually coming out with a line of their own?

JDH

jthanatos:

JDH:

I have it from a very reliable source that Willett is releasing a 21 year bourbon, possibly this week. It should retail just above $150.00 for 750 ml

Is this in addition to their 21 single barrel cask strength that various stores carry? I have seen a few stores with their own picks of those from anywhere between $120 and $220. As in, are they actually coming out with a line of their own?

I did not get details. The guy gave me the price and my eyes just kind of glazed over. If you want, I will stop in after work this evening and get the lowdown. My other problem is that I don't pay close enough attention to these limited releases, and usually miss out.

jthanatos

JDH:

jthanatos:

JDH:

I have it from a very reliable source that Willett is releasing a 21 year bourbon, possibly this week. It should retail just above $150.00 for 750 ml

Is this in addition to their 21 single barrel cask strength that various stores carry? I have seen a few stores with their own picks of those from anywhere between $120 and $220. As in, are they actually coming out with a line of their own?

I did not get details. The guy gave me the price and my eyes just kind of glazed over. If you want, I will stop in after work this evening and get the lowdown. My other problem is that I don't pay close enough attention to these limited releases, and usually miss out.

PM to you.