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Definition, please??

jlmartajlmarta 50 miles from ParadisePosts: 7,385 ✭✭✭✭✭
Okay, guys, once again I need help from the learned masses. I keep seeing references to "boutique cigars" and I don't know what that means. Are they referring to little 'mom & pop' cigar factories like the Conch Republic Cigar Factory in Key West, Florida or maybe Casilla's Cigars in Sacramento, CA?

Or is a boutique cigar something else altogether?

Thanks for your help.

Marty

Comments

  • rwheelwrightrwheelwright Posts: 3,296
    I think Boutique cigars are cigars that are not cheap but are made by smaller companies and not mass produced like Fuente, Ashton, Upmann, Partagas, Monticristo, R&J, etc... That is what I have gotten out of it.
  • betasynnbetasynn Posts: 1,249
    Marketing ploy, in my opinion. For example, the Padilla Obsidian is listed as a Boutique cigar, but it's pretty common.
  • FairwindFairwind Posts: 41

    rwheelwright:
    I think Boutique cigars are cigars that are not cheap but are made by smaller companies and not mass produced like Fuente, Ashton, Upmann, Partagas, Monticristo, R&J, etc... That is what I have gotten out of it.

     

    The ones you listed are Brands. They make the same type of cigar year after year with little or no variation.

     

    I love the guy's cigars, but to me Rocky Patel is a perfect example of a Boutique cigar maker. How many new names does he come up with and for how many big distributors such as Famous, Cigar.com or Holts? On Holts for example you can buy "Ocean Club", but not on the other sites. Cigar.com you get "Royal Vintage or Summer Collection". It's the same for all the online stores. 

     

    Like I said I like and buy his cigars, but he should just cut all the BS and make cigars that are his and everyone sells them. Quit trying to BS me by calling the same cigar a different name and give it a fancy label and calling it New and Different.

     

    Dan 

  • FairwindFairwind Posts: 41

    jlmarta:
    or maybe Casilla's Cigars in Sacramento, CA?

    Wow, I thought for sure no one would ever mention these guys. Every time I go to Sacramento for the last 20+ years I visit them. They split in two a few years ago. A cousin runs the original shop under his name and down the street on the opposite side of the street is Casilla's.

     

    Too bad they don't hand roll like they used to. When California passed that Tobacco prop, they had to stop as it just got too expensive. But they do have the most aromatic blend I have ever tasted. Every size you can think of and they infuse some of their cigars with cognac. They also do mail order. A great little family business.

     

    I'll visit them this Saturday then off to Capitol Park for a relaxing morning smoking, read the Sunday paper and have a Starbucks triple venti mocha with hazelnut.

     

    Dan

  • nightmaremike31nightmaremike31 Posts: 720
    betasynn:
    Marketing ploy, in my opinion. For example, the Padilla Obsidian is listed as a Boutique cigar, but it's pretty common.

    I'm not trying to be an antagonist, but I couldn't find where the Padilla Obsidian was a Boutique cigar. I did read that originally in 2006 there were only supposed to be 50,000 produced, but in 2007 CI obtained the blend and is will be continuing it.
    Fairwind:
    I love the guy's cigars, but to me Rocky Patel is a perfect example of a Boutique cigar maker. How many new names does he come up with and for how many big distributors such as Famous, Cigar.com or Holts? Holts for example you can buy "Ocean Club", but not on the other sites. Cigar.com you get "Royal Vintage or Summer Collection". It's the same for all the online stores.

    But I totally understand what you are both saying about marketing. But then again, if you could increase business and profit by offering a different label to another distributor, would you? I've always dreamt about what it would be like to own and manage my own cigar company, and if the opportunity arose to expand my blend among a larger demographic, it would be hard to pass up.
  • kuzi16kuzi16 Posts: 14,616 ✭✭✭✭
    according to Smoke magazine online
    Smoke Magazine Online:
    "boutique" cigar brands - defined here as brands with a production of less than 1.5 million sticks per year


    and according to Stogie Review
    Stogie Review:
    a boutique manufacturer in my eyes needs to be a manufacturer and not just a brand owner. They need to produce a limited number of cigars, and they need to be limited due to a small number of employees and high quality control standards rather than a manufactured “limited production”. A boutique manufacturer needs to pour their heart and should into their brand and stand behind it. In my eyes, a manufacturer looses the boutique designation as soon as they loose the above mentioned qualities. While I love cigars produced by individuals such as Don Pepin Garcia, I could never consider him, or any of his brand extensions, boutique simply because of the overall size of his operation.
    I feel that you can insert rockey patel, gurkha, and maybe even oliva into that statement and have it be true.


    so what do I feel is a brand that is a boutique?

    Verdadero Organic, maybe Stradivarius and G.A.R.
  • jlmartajlmarta 50 miles from ParadisePosts: 7,385 ✭✭✭✭✭
    A curious thing about Casilla's...I used to check out their website periodically to tease myself with their offerings. I looked at all the photos of Pedro and Luis (I think his name was Luis) etc., yadda, yadda.

    Just the other day I tried for the website again but the server couldn't connect. So, I called them to see if they were still in business. The guy who answered said they are but, here's the curious part, he spoke with an East Indian accent.

    I was so surprised I didn't think to ask if the Casilla family had sold out or just what was going on. I plan to swing by there this Saturday to find out for myself. I only live about 50 miles away from there.

    Marty

  • nightmaremike31nightmaremike31 Posts: 720
    And the heavens part as the light from the mighty kuzi pours down upon us.
    Very impressive mr. kuzi. Your ability to obtain and retain knowledge is always accurate and precise. If I ever get filthy rich and try to dive in to the world of cigar manufacturing, I'll come to you with a huge list of questions.
  • kuzi16kuzi16 Posts: 14,616 ✭✭✭✭
    nightmaremike31:
    And the heavens part as the light from the mighty kuzi pours down upon us.
    Very impressive mr. kuzi. Your ability to obtain and retain knowledge is always accurate and precise. If I ever get filthy rich and try to dive in to the world of cigar manufacturing, I'll come to you with a huge list of questions.
    flattery will get you everywhere...

    however, im not good at retaining knowledge. I good at remembering where to find things. I have about 75 bookmarks just on the topic of cigars.

    and i have a very good circle of friends made up of search engines.

    again, my nerd is showing.
  • nightmaremike31nightmaremike31 Posts: 720
    Your friends will always be there when you need anything. I "goog" all over the place about anything and everything too.
    You shouldn't keep your nerd locked up all the time, let him air out every now and then. Let it run free through the digital tobacco fields of CCOM!
  • jlmartajlmarta 50 miles from ParadisePosts: 7,385 ✭✭✭✭✭
    And NightmareMike just reminded me that I could probably have answered my own question had I "googled" boutique cigars in the first place. Here are some of the answers I located:

    http://www.smokemag.com/0699/feature.htm

    http://stroblecigars.com/whatisaboutiquecigar

    http://cigars.about.com/od/reviewsratings1/fr/gurkhacigar.htm

    http://www.thompsoncigar.com/products/p-69983.shtml

    http://cigaradvisor.blogspot.com/2009/01/brain-dead-cigar-smokers-come-on-really.html

    So, if you've looked at all these, you'll know that I don't know any more now than I did before with the possible exception of the 'production of 1.5 million or less' thing.

    Oh, well, I didn't want to know as much as Kuzi does about cigars, anyway. (Just kidding, Kuzi - no offense)

    Marty

  • FairwindFairwind Posts: 41

    A nephew or cousin runs it for the original owner who moved back to Nicaragua. He runs the rolling down there. The guy who answered the phone is counter help.

     

    I'll be there around 11 to 11:30, ask for Dan if you want to meet me. BTW, it's not the original location but the one up the street on the left side. Here's the map

    http://yellowpages.kcra.com/casillas+cigars.327667.69054870.home.html

     

    Dan

  • betasynnbetasynn Posts: 1,249
    Nightmare Mike: s'ok, not antagonizing me.


    Kuzi: I bow to thy knowledge. Seriously, you're an encyclopedia, and/or a google master.

  • jlmartajlmarta 50 miles from ParadisePosts: 7,385 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Thanks for the info, Dan. I was talking about the store on Madison, near Sunrise. That's the one I called and the guy told me they had taken down the website.

    If memory serves me correctly, there's (or was) another store in Reno.

    It just gets curioser and curioser, don't it?

    I'd look forward to meeting you, Dan, but I'll be going to the store on Madison. Any chance of you going to that one?

    Marty

  • FairwindFairwind Posts: 41
    Well I will be meeting someone off of Richards at 10 am and the one on 15th is on the way home. Also I like to buy from the original guys and not one of the former stores.

    BTW - they used to have stores in Reno, Vacaville, Salt Lake City, Tampa and one other. I didn't know about the one on Madison.

    Well if you can make it a few miles more down 50, then take the 15th ave exit, I'll cya there.

    Dan
  • Garen BGaren B Posts: 977
    betasynn:
    Kuzi: I bow to thy knowledge. Seriously, you're an encyclopedia, and/or a google master.
    The Google-fu is strong with this one...
  • nightmaremike31nightmaremike31 Posts: 720
    betasynn:
    Nightmare Mike: s'ok, not antagonizing me.


    Kuzi: I bow to thy knowledge. Seriously, you're an encyclopedia, and/or a google master.


    You were totally right about the Obsidian's being a Boutique label. I work in the warehousing and shipping industry, and I manage Year to Date sales of Furnaces and A/C's, I think it would be interesting to see YTD stats on cigars. But that's my nerd coming out to play.
  • jlmartajlmarta 50 miles from ParadisePosts: 7,385 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Sorry, Dan, our timetables just aren't going to mesh this time. I'm always interested in meeting other cigar-enjoyers in the area, though. Maybe another time.

    I live in Yuba City, CA and the closest B&M to me is Tobacco Republic in Loomis. They have an event scheduled for July 18 in Rocklin and rocky Patel is scheduled to be there, in case you're interested. More info is available at trcigar.com. I won't be going to that one, much as I'd like to, but possibly the next one. We may run into one another at one of their events.

    Marty

  • jlmartajlmarta 50 miles from ParadisePosts: 7,385 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Yo, Fairwind Dan, I was just surfin and checkin' out a few old links and guess what I found? A link to the website I mentioned to you where they had all the photos of the principal players, etc. Only now, the website is back up and running but it's been modified.....most, if not all, of the photos have disappeared and the head honcho has a different name.

    Check it out when you have a chance: http://casillascigars.com/default.asp

    You seem to have the most knowledge about this operation....is the store on 15th still the original? What else can you tell me about these folks?

    Marty

  • FairwindFairwind Posts: 41
    Hi Marty, I stopped by the store on Saturday and here's what I found out.

    First off the original location is now Cardenas Cigars, a cousin of the owner. There was a blow-up in the family.

    Casillas moved down the street on the opposite side and is still called Casillas. It's being run by a nephew.

    Casillas Cigars
    2201 16th St
    Sacramento, CA 95818
    916-448-5052

    Here is the Casillas Cigar site: http://casillascigarfactory.com/

    Macario Casillas, the founder and owner, is bouncing between Nicaragua and Costa Rica managing the factories rolling his cigars.

    I asked about the one in Citrus Heights and the guy told me he buys from them and is a outlet/franchise. Same for all the other locations.

    That's all I can tell you other than their cigars are on the mild side and very aromatic.

    Dan
  • jlmartajlmarta 50 miles from ParadisePosts: 7,385 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Wow, Dan! That's a bunch more info that I might've expected. Thanks very much for the effort.

    See, I was under the impression that the one at 2201 16th St. was the original. Now I know better. And, when I went to the website, it turns out that the address they're showing is of the factory in Miami, Fla. but no mention of anyplace in Sacramento.

    Things just get curiouser and curiouser, don't they? I can live with the "mild and very aromatic" part, though, so I guess I'll have to venture down that way one of these days. Oh, by the way, the photos they show on the website are of guys I never saw before - I was led to believe they were the owner and a son when I saw the other website. But I didn't recognize anyone on this website.

    Anyway, thanks again for the info.

    Marty

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