Engine swap question...

LiquidChaos66LiquidChaos66 OregonPosts: 3,767 ✭✭✭✭
Currently my '66 mustang has the 200 straight 6 in it. Great motor but rather tired and gutless. I would love to upgrade it to a 289 or 302. I loved the 289 in my first mustang and would prefer to install one of those more than anything else. I know there is a lot to do to the car when installing a v8 instead of a straight 6. But do I need to do a conversion from 4-lug to a 5-lug setup? I know its recommended but im gonna be installing a front brake conversion to disks soon and would hate to put the money into something that I have to do away with. Thanks in advance! :)
Life is like a blind fiver. You never know what you're gonna get.

Comments

  • 0patience0patience Oregon CoastPosts: 8,830 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Yes and no.
    The best thing is to find a kit for the front spindles and brakes and swap them.
    Wait, you have a 4 lug on a 66? Did someone swap disks onto that car?
    There is no crisis that a good cigar can't cure.
    In Fumo Pax
    Money can't buy happiness, but it can buy cigars and that's close enough.

    Wylaff said:
    Atmospheric pressure and crap.
  • LiquidChaos66LiquidChaos66 OregonPosts: 3,767 ✭✭✭✭
    0patience:
    Yes and no.
    The best thing is to find a kit for the front spindles and brakes and swap them.
    Wait, you have a 4 lug on a 66? Did someone swap disks onto that car?


    Nope stock 4 lugs. All the stock 6 cylinder fords came with 4-lugs all around. I was just hoping to avoid spending money on a new set of wheels too lol
    Life is like a blind fiver. You never know what you're gonna get.
  • 90+_Irishman90+_Irishman Loveland, COPosts: 12,440 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Engine mounts will need to change as will the stuff Tony mentioned. You will also want to think about the Trans and rear end you have behind it to make sure you won't ovwrpower them. Likely not an issue but better to check than just assume. With Ford many of the early small locks were the same engine block just different bore and stroke, I'm a Chevy guy so I really don't know for sure but could swear that was true. Hope that helps.
    "When walking in open territory bother no one. If someone bothers you, ask them to stop. If they do not stop, destroy them."
  • LiquidChaos66LiquidChaos66 OregonPosts: 3,767 ✭✭✭✭
    All good info! I was looking for a engine tranny combo and then also a new rear end. I think I have a for 9inch already but I would have to confirm it. Part of me is thinking cost wise and parts wise... I might find a modern mustang and transplant as much as I can from the modern one to my classic. Maybe just find a way to do a body swap... if thats possible.
    Life is like a blind fiver. You never know what you're gonna get.
  • 90+_Irishman90+_Irishman Loveland, COPosts: 12,440 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Doing a drivetrain swap is a very good idea plus it is something that is very popular so there are a lot of forums that have step by step instructions or at least postings of how they swapped out. The more popular the swap the more aftermarket parts are manufactured specifically for that swap to make it easier.
    "When walking in open territory bother no one. If someone bothers you, ask them to stop. If they do not stop, destroy them."
  • LiquidChaos66LiquidChaos66 OregonPosts: 3,767 ✭✭✭✭
    Well I think my game plan is to now purchase a mid-late 90s mustang GT and do a drivetrain swap as well as anything that I can transplant... time to get to the drawing board and figure out what all I can do! :)
    Life is like a blind fiver. You never know what you're gonna get.
  • 0patience0patience Oregon CoastPosts: 8,830 ✭✭✭✭✭
    The cheapest way would be to find a V-8 MustangII and swap the front end to your 66.
    Fatman Fabrication used to make the best conversion kits. Not sure if they still do.
    Going with a V-8, you'll want front disk anyways, so you'll need to swap out the spindles too, so it's probably best to get most the stuff in a kit or a full donor car.
    Check with All American Classics in Vancouver, they usually have a pretty good supply of older Mustang stuff.

    Remember that Comets, Cougars, Fairlanes and Mavericks all used the same front end parts.

    So here is a line out of what you will need.

    Engine and trans. Best to go with a small block (289 or 320) and small block C-4, as the Cleveland and big blocks will be nightmares to fit into that car and a C-6 would be expensive for the small block
    Motor mounts for the V-8.

    If a manual transmission, you will need at least the 10 1/2" or 11" clutch. The 10" clutch won't do well behind any performance V-8. They barely hold up on a stock V-8.

    Exhaust for the V-8. Usually can pull from donor car.
    Driveline will have to be fit correctly. If pulling from an early model Mustang, it might fit. But might not.
    Radiator. Probably best to go with an aluminum performance radiator, as they fit the best and work great.

    Rear end. This is where it get's foggy. Some early model Mustangs came with the same rear end housing for V-8 and 6 cylinder. Youwould need to find out for certain which rear end you have, as there were many options for both 6 cylinder and V-8.

    If going for the 90's swap, remember that you will need everything. ECM, Sensors, harnesses.
    You will also need the fuel tank from the 90s vehicle if it is an in tank fuel pump. Which after 86, most are.

    Late model to early model swaps, while worth it, can be a huge undertaking.
    Anything later than 93, stay away from, as they use a speed sensor and changing to that would involve way more work and modifications than you want to deal with.
    And if you go with an AOD automatic transmission, you might have to change out the old swing style linkage shifter to a cable shifter like a B&M star shifter.

    Not sure if I covered everything or not, but it's what I can think of off hand.

    Oh, almost forgot. If you need wiring. Painless Performance makes harnesses for everything.
    There is no crisis that a good cigar can't cure.
    In Fumo Pax
    Money can't buy happiness, but it can buy cigars and that's close enough.

    Wylaff said:
    Atmospheric pressure and crap.
  • 90+_Irishman90+_Irishman Loveland, COPosts: 12,440 ✭✭✭✭✭
    BRILLIANT info Tony wow, couldn't agree more and the companies you listed are exactly the ones I had in mind, used Painless wiring harnesses for years best in the industry!
    "When walking in open territory bother no one. If someone bothers you, ask them to stop. If they do not stop, destroy them."
  • LiquidChaos66LiquidChaos66 OregonPosts: 3,767 ✭✭✭✭
    Dang! Killer info!!! That will really help me out in the process! :) thank you very much!
    Life is like a blind fiver. You never know what you're gonna get.
  • 0patience0patience Oregon CoastPosts: 8,830 ✭✭✭✭✭
    If you need more help, let me know.
    I've done many swaps.

    Mustangs, Camaros and Novas mostly.
    But there have been big block Chevy Luvs and Small block and big block Chevy Vegas and Monzas too.
    If you ever get the idea to try and swap big blocks in Chevy Luvs or Vegas, don't.
    You will want to destroy things before you are done. LOL!

    Currently looking to put a 64 Chevy pickup body on a 93 Chevy Z71 4x4 Silverado frame and running gear.
    I want to go with a short wide box, but while the 93 silverados are fairly easy to find in a short box, the 64-66 short wide boxes are getting harder to find.

    Remember that if you are going to a late model fuel injected set up, it's sometimes better to gut the wiring and start over.
    There is no crisis that a good cigar can't cure.
    In Fumo Pax
    Money can't buy happiness, but it can buy cigars and that's close enough.

    Wylaff said:
    Atmospheric pressure and crap.
  • LiquidChaos66LiquidChaos66 OregonPosts: 3,767 ✭✭✭✭
    So ive done A LOT of research and came to the conclusion that I am not going to do a V8 conversion. Just WAY too much work and too expensive for my budget and my wifes tastes. lol So ive settled into the idea of doing a straight 6 swap. I have my eyes on a Ford 300 inline 6. It will mate up to my current tranny and the stock motor mounts. All I would have to do is get it in for exhaust work and I should be fine. Plus there is a whole world of performance parts to it than the 200 inline 6 I have now.
    Life is like a blind fiver. You never know what you're gonna get.
  • LiquidChaos66LiquidChaos66 OregonPosts: 3,767 ✭✭✭✭
    Crap... I may have come into a full 289 for only $250 from a very trusted friend
    Life is like a blind fiver. You never know what you're gonna get.
  • 0patience0patience Oregon CoastPosts: 8,830 ✭✭✭✭✭
    LOL!
    That might make it worth doing.
    Is your car auto or manual?
    I'd check with PickNPull on Foster or All American Classic in Vancouver for a transmission.
    If manual, bellhousing too.
    Summit has aluminum radiators for $249. If auto trans, make sure you either get a radiator with trans hook ups or a seperate trans cooler.
    And if you need a driveline, Six States on Columbia Blvd can make you up a driveline.
    Again, check the differential to see exactly what you have.
    If it isn't a V-8 rearend, you might be able to make a deal with All American Classic on the correct rearend for your's and selling them your 6 cyl rearend.

    If it's an automatic, it will be a whole lot easier than a manual transmission, but then again, you could go with a newer 5 speed transmission. A T-5 or T-45 would probably be what you'd want to look for.
    Virtually anything pre-93 with mechanical speedo gear from a small block will work.
    And if the 289 is out of a car, it's likely that the exhaust manifolds will be usable.
    You'd just have to have the exhaust pipe and mufflers fit.
    If you can avoid headers, you'll be better off for a daily driver.

    And do yourself a favor and knock out all the steel freeze/soft plugs and install brass ones.
    You'll be glad you did in a couple years when the steel ones would have rotted out.

    And if it's a used engine that's been sitting around for a while, replace the water pump, thermostat and fuel pump.
    The reason is, the seals in the water pump have likely dried up, the thermostat just because it's good to do when ever you open the cooling system and the fuel pump, because if the diaphragm is old and dried out, if it cracks, it will leak fuel into your oil, which bearings do not like fuel thinned oil.

    I missed something, but can't think of it right now. LOL!
    There is no crisis that a good cigar can't cure.
    In Fumo Pax
    Money can't buy happiness, but it can buy cigars and that's close enough.

    Wylaff said:
    Atmospheric pressure and crap.
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