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Craps, anyone....??

jlmartajlmarta Posts: 7,881 ✭✭✭✭✭
in Non Cigar Related
Do we have any craps players on the forum?  I've got a few questions regarding the game. I'm willing to chat back and forth via this thread or PM, whichever....

Thanks....

Comments

  • cbuckcbuck Posts: 8,755 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I love it, but won't be able to chat until Sunday when I get home from Florida! Great game, pretty good odds, as long as you stay away from the center bets!
  • jlmartajlmarta Posts: 7,881 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Cool. Let me know when you have some time to kill...

    and, yeah, I'm a pretty conservative bettor...
  • Edna20Edna20 Posts: 1,323 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I love craps, but it's a streaky game. Money can come fast but can go faster. If you get a hot table stay, cold table walk away!! 
    Team O'Donnell FTW!
  • jlmartajlmarta Posts: 7,881 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Edna20 said:
    ......If you get a hot table stay, cold table walk away!! 
    I agree wholeheartedly. In my younger years I didn't have the control to do that but I don't have that problem any longer. 

    My principal question(s) are about the odds casinos pay on certain bets. I know the true odds but what casinos pay can evidently vary. That's what arouses my curiosity right now. In a perfect world, one or more of the BOTLs may have worked as a dealer at casino craps....

    ive tried googling the question but got no solid answers...
  • danielzreyesdanielzreyes Posts: 8,771 ✭✭✭✭✭
    6 and 8. Hard 6 hard 8. 2 dollar Yo!
    "It's plume, bro. Nothing to worry about. Got any Opus?" The suppose to be DZR
  • jlmartajlmarta Posts: 7,881 ✭✭✭✭✭
    danielzreyes said:
    6 and 8. Hard 6 hard 8. 2 dollar Yo!
    Hmmmm. I see. Well, uh, ya see, being the, um, conservative bettor that I am, I stay away from proposition bets....  :#

    But thanks, @danielzreyes....  I'll look into it. 
  • danielzreyesdanielzreyes Posts: 8,771 ✭✭✭✭✭
    What Qs did you have, Marty?
    "It's plume, bro. Nothing to worry about. Got any Opus?" The suppose to be DZR
  • jlmartajlmarta Posts: 7,881 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I'm primarily curious about odds payouts with regard to 'come' bets. For example, let's say I'm playing at a table with a $5 minimum and a $1,000 maximum bet. There's always a small placard posted stating the table limits. The placard for this example says "3x - 4x - 5x odds". Now, I've always been told that this means I can place an odds bet on a come bet that's equal to 3, 4, or 5 times the amount of my come bet. And I've always done that in the past. 

    Now, we know that the true odds of rolling a 4 or 10 on a given throw of the dice is 2:1. And the true odds on a 5 or 9 are 3:2. Likewise, on a 6 or 8 the true odds are 6:5. 

    I've also always been told that because 3:2 odds on a given bet can produce a winning amount ending in 50 cents and, since the casino doesn't deal in 50 cent increments on a craps table, if you win such a bet you'll forfeit the 50 cents because of that. A minor point, but true. So, in order to avoid that little item, if you bet in multiples of 2 (2 chips, 4chips, etc.) then the payout will always be an even dollar amount. 

    In the past, I've always done that - placed my odds bets in multiples of 2. Sometimes, if the table is running hot, I'll double up on my odds bets betting 4 chips instead of the 2. I've never been called on it and it's not been an issue in the past. 

    The other night, the table had warmed up fairly well so I began to double up on my odds bets when possible. I made a $5 come bet and a 10 was rolled. The dealer moved my chip to the 10 box and I placed 4 chips in the 'come' area and asked for odds on my 10. I was told I could only make an odds bet of 3 chips. I said 'Okay' and play resumed. 

    Later, on a come bet, a 5 was rolled. Again, I laid out 4 chips and asked for odds. This time it was accepted which confused me so I asked about it. 

    I was told that when the placard states '3x, 4x, 5x' that means I was limited to 3 times my bet on a 4 or 10, 4 times my bet on a 5 or 9, and 5 times my bet on a 6 or 8. 

    I had never heard of this but I had no choice but to comply if I wanted to continue playing. Maybe it was just a rule of that particular casino - I don't know. Have you ever heard of that?
  • cbuckcbuck Posts: 8,755 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited October 2015
    Did you win on the 4 chip odds bet? It could be they didn't notice it, but if you won, they may have returned the extra chip, and not have paid on it. 3,4,and 5 are pretty common. Supposedly, Binion's Horseshoe in Vegas allowed 10 times odds! They can make up those rules on their own, as long as it's posted. The odds bet at craps is the only bet that is paid at true odds, and reduces the casino advantage substantially. I generally make one pass, and two come bets, all with full allowed odds. As one wins, I increase it, and take full odds. At a double odds table, house advantage is reduced to a .60 percent, and gets better as the allowed odds increase.
    Post edited by cbuck on
  • cbuckcbuck Posts: 8,755 ✭✭✭✭✭
    @jlmarta  And they don't change the payout, only how much odds they let you bet. If you can do a pass line or come for $1, at even money, and $10 more at true odds, that's pretty good! On the 4 and 10, you get back 21 for your 11 dollars bet. Correct odds would be 22 for your 11. Very little in favor of the house! Back when I first started playing, back when Atlantic City opened, most tables were single odds, with the occasional double odds table mixed in. Then Foxwoods and Mohegan Sun opened, and I saw the 3, 4, and 5x odds, I thought it was great! Gambling is the one time in my life where my A+ in Statistics and Probabilities has been used in my real life!
  • danielzreyesdanielzreyes Posts: 8,771 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Are you guys playing all across the board? Ballers

    I only play random numbers when I start winning.  
    "It's plume, bro. Nothing to worry about. Got any Opus?" The suppose to be DZR
  • jlmartajlmarta Posts: 7,881 ✭✭✭✭✭
    danielzreyes said:
    Are you guys playing all across the board? Ballers

    I only play random numbers when I start winning.  
    I don't know about all across the board...  I pretty much play the way @cbuck plays - a pass line bet and two come bets, all with odds. 
  • jlmartajlmarta Posts: 7,881 ✭✭✭✭✭
    cbuck said:
    Did you win on the 4 chip odds bet? It could be they didn't notice it, but if you won, they may have returned the extra chip, and not have paid on it. 3,4,and 5 are pretty common. Supposedly, Binion's Horseshoe in Vegas allowed 10 times odds! They can make up those rules on their own, as long as it's posted. The odds bet at craps is the only bet that is paid at true odds, and reduces the casino advantage substantially. I generally make one pass, and two come bets, all with full allowed odds. As one wins, I increase it, and take full odds. At a double odds table, house advantage is reduced to a .60 percent, and gets better as the allowed odds increase.
    I won the bets where I had four chips as an odds bet but you're right, they may have only paid three and returned my fourth without saying anything. I didn't count the payouts. 

    So, you're saying it's pretty much normal to allow me to bet only 3 chips as an odds bet on 4 or 10, etc?  Okay, then they told me right. It just didn't jive with my first experience at that casino so I was confused. Thanks very much, @cbuck. 

    I think I may try your method of increasing a bet as it wins. That makes sense to me.  I've just been maintaining, not increasing. Thanks for this bit of info, too.  B)
  • cbuckcbuck Posts: 8,755 ✭✭✭✭✭
    @jlmarta  There is a good book by Edward Silberstein, not sure of the spelling of the last name, and don't have the book anymore. I think it was called "Gambling for Winners". It covers most of the games, tells you the odds of each game, best play, and aggressive play, and even money management. For craps, the aggressive method makes the 6 and 8 as place bets if they are not covered on the first 3 numbers, and increasing after each number wins. It also tells you when to stop if at a cold table. It was a great book, and if I had the self control to do what it said, would have been a winner most of the time. Still did pretty well! Even with my greed! 
  • jlmartajlmarta Posts: 7,881 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Thanks for the input, @cbuck. I appreciate it very much and will look for the book. 

    Further cogitating on the 3, 4, 5 bit cleared up the logic of it for me and I was surprised by the simplicity of it. It not only puts more money in your pocket quicker but it also makes it easier on the dealer since, no matter which number wins, the payout is the same - 7 chips. That's brilliant. I love simplicity.  B)
  • jlmartajlmarta Posts: 7,881 ✭✭✭✭✭
    cbuck said:
    @jlmarta  There is a good book by Edward Silberstein, not sure of the spelling of the last name, and don't have the book anymore. I think it was called "Gambling for Winners". 
    I've located one titled "The Winner's Guide to Casino Gambling" by Edwin Silberstang. I'm assuming it's the one you're thinking of. 
  • cbuckcbuck Posts: 8,755 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Yes, that is it. Excellent book, no matter which game you play! And your right, it is simple. Even my wife caught on quickly! She loves it too! 
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