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Shipping Bad / Resting Good ???
peter4jc
Posts: 15,433 ✭✭✭✭✭
Because my favorite pastime is shooting holes in widely accepted practices, let's talk about resting cigars after we receive them...
What is it about the transit that concerns us? How valid are those concerns, and how to ameliorate the issues?
Let's assume for this argument, that they were stored properly before they embarked on their journey to us.
Are there any seasons/weather conditions that you feel would safe to smoke ROTT?
Is there anything more to your 'resting upon arrival' practice than you'd simply rather be safe than sorry?
"I could've had a Mi Querida!" Nick Bardis
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If it’s 100 degrees out I’ll wait a day..... but that’s it. Fall - Spring I’ll smoke one right out of the box.
I can understand one point that’s been kicked around and you hit on it..... proper storage before hitting the cardboard for its journey.
Same here, Pete. We have a lot of hundred degree days in Vegas, and in the summertime, I'll rarely smoke one right off the porch, all joking aside.
However, after a day in my humidor, the temperature of the cigars comes back down to what my humidor is. At that point, what difference does it make if the tobacco has been 70° for one day or one month? It is still 70°.
The remaining issue might be relative humidity. If perfectly stored cigars are shipped with a boveda pack, then the pack may release more moisture into the plastic bag once the temperature of the bag rises, because the boveda theoretically keeps the container at a particular humidity and warmer air holds more moisture.
Even so, I don't think that the moisture from the boveda on the outside of the cigar penetrates all the way through all of the air inside of the cigar. I think that it more serves to keep the wrapper from drying out so that the moisture in the binder and filler don't then migrate out in an attempt to attain stasis.
all of that said, properly stored and shipped cigars probably don't have much fluctuation in RH over a couple of short days. The biggest risk that you run is probably with the wrapper of the cigar itself. Therefore, once the temperature returns to normal, you should have no issues smoking the cigar and it should not perform any differently than it would a week or a month later.
For the record, I have smoked stuff right off the truck as you well know, and I haven't noticed a discernible difference in performance between a minute and a day, or a day and a week, under fairly normal temperatures. I have also smoked Right off the truck during the hot summer months and I have noticed performance issues, but after a day, I haven't.
I’m expecting a few cigars today. I’ll throw on my Hygrometer see what it says...
Smallbatch actually did a study on this using technology.
MOW badge received.
'Atmospheric pressure and crap,' to quote our friend Wayne.
And...?
Here ya go.
https://www.smallbatchcigar.com/how-does-shipping-affect-cigars-temperature-humidity-and-you
MOW badge received.
All my shipments are getting rescheduled and delayed now making this more important. Thanks.
It seems like the few times I have been inpatient and smoked one the day it arrives, it just isnt as good. Seems like they are more likely to taste harsh or be flat tasting... usually what I associate with too high humidity. But you know, sometimes they are just fine.
I am thinking mostly summer. I must buy more cigars in the summer because thats what comes to mind for me.
I would say "proper" storage and your preferred storage can be different to. Maybe most of the reason I tey amd wait is so that I know what rh they are sitting at.
It seems like they want you to purchase over night or their new “we will drive it to you within 24 hours for $100 bucks” option.
Oops sorry. The $100 option of on hold!
The only thing I do with a cigar right off the truck is freeze them for a week or so.
I like smoking mine on the dryer side, so I let them sit for at least a month or two to lose some rh. I read some place, it takes a month to lose 2% rh
Just an observation on my part, but it seem like cigars from the big suppliers seem to be pretty wet. While smaller places seems to a lot closer to proper rh.
As for shipping....I'm on the East Coast and most of the places I order from are too, so I'm a two day ground ship point. The only exception would be the cc...Now I'm looking a three weeks to a month lead time.
I read the article. Interesting. Two points:
They should have done one with a boveda to see what happens, especially since they ship everything with a boveda. Does a bovada react as fast as the conditions inside the box? I think the answer is no, but at the same time, I think that the fluctuations would have been a lot smaller. I'd also like to see the results with different sizes of boveda packs in the same box.
Nice data on an empty box, but how does this affect cigars? most of us believe that cigars gain and lose humidity very slowly, and so that is why we rest them after shipment. So if they lose humidity so slowly, will they lose enough during shipment to make a difference? Especially with a boveda pack?
Which goes back to my original question. Do you have to rest them if the temperature and humidity is correct? I understand that wine goes through a sick period when it's temperature fluctuates. Since the tobacco cannot referment, does it still go through the sick period? I suspect that the answer is no if it has been properly aged already.
Who said tobacco can't referment?
^^^I'm wondering too, if they had their humidity gauge thingie in one of their plastic bags. My guess is that the bags (along w/ the boveda) would minimize swings.
Nick perdomo for one. For two, it would have to attain temperatures in excess of 150° to make it theoretically possible. I think you could ship these to the equator and back and not reach those types of temperatures.
And, if I'm not mistaken, it would have to be arranged to minimize airflow I'm order to raise the temp and build the ammonia. Since cigars are made to specifically enhance airflow, I don't know how possible fermenting is with an aged cigar (Cubans being a separate issue, since they're underaged, rolled too tight, and are shipped too wet).
From my standpoint, the humidity in my area is generally above 80%.
Being right on the coast, it comes down sometimes.
But, I have found that there are times I will try and smoke something ROTT and have problems. Whether it is because the cigars lost humidity in shipping or I didn't let them sit where I was going to smoke, I don't know.
I do know that if I let them acclimate for a week or so, I don't seem to have the problems.
I cannot definitively say that it works for everyone, just my unique conditions.
Money can't buy happiness, but it can buy cigars and that's close enough.
I've wasted boxes worth of cigars by being impatient. Two weeks naked is the minimum for me. Summer is the worst time to buy and consume. Winter is optimal. I just recently wasted 5 cigars by being impatient but it was for a good cause, deciding quickly to capitalize on sales. I generally prefer a year+ for cigars stored cello on. I choose my blends carefully and know that if I like it young, I'll love it aged. Well rounded flavors that intermingle, vs dominate characteristics is what I'm after. This generally requires buying and storing vs buying to consume.
Unless you are out of cigars, what's the rush?
I'll pull a couple out of any shipment, probably smoke them within a week. My own subjective experience has been that almost all are better in 4 - 6 weeks, and many if not most continue to improve for about 6 months.
I don't know why.
I assume that those that don't change much, and start off pretty good are not too old, have been stored well, and were shipped under optimal conditions. Meaning no over-the-weekend stays at the top of a semi sitting in the sun when the ambient temperature is 102 and the temperature inside that closed semi, near the top, is at least 137 degrees, etc.
Some seem to continue to improve for a couple of years, others not so much.
I don't know why.
This seems to work for me, subjectively, for whatever reason.
Y'all go on and do whatever trips your triggers. Be happy.
"If you do not read the newspapers you're uninformed. If you do read the newspapers, you're misinformed." -- Mark Twain
Sounds like aging ^
Well, I am getting all the Medicare ads in the mail, and...what were we talking about?
"If you do not read the newspapers you're uninformed. If you do read the newspapers, you're misinformed." -- Mark Twain
Why the waiting time? Because I don't know how long they've been improperly maintained before being shipped to me. For all I know they were dipped in a Sasquatch's nut sauce and hanged on the back porch to air out. More like an overcrowded warehouse ill kept by teenagers and then shipped in a humidified bag in triple digit temperatures. I like knowing that my investment is going to make a full recovery. Boveda has done the research, I trust their judgement when they say three weeks or more to level out cigars, I go with that and it seems to work. It not dog rocket science, just the art of having patience.
Yep,.... Shipping Bad. Resting Good. That's the entire text of the Cliff Notes study guide to all of the following articles.
WHY YOU SHOULD BE RESTING YOUR CIGARS
RESTING YOUR CIGARS AFTER DELIVERY
THE BENEFITS OF RESTING PREMIUM CIGARS
CIGAR DELIVERY: RESTING CIGARS AFTERWARDS
I got plenty of advice on this subject from plenty of members here on the forum when I first joined. I followed this advice. I assumed it was valid. I have not attempted to determine it's validity. I can't remember a bad experience with smoking ROTT, because I can't remember doing that. But, I always say "One of these days I'm gonna flavor-test some cigars by taking one of each type (of which I have multiples,) from my stash and replicate summertime shipment temperatures by stashing them in a hot vehicle in my driveway for a few days and immediately smoke them side by side with a same identical cigar that had the (perceived) advantage of remaining indoors inside my humidor/cooler." But as most of you know, I have not done this yet. I would have authored a thread titled, "ROTT test results", by now if I had. But anyone reading this is welcome to go ahead and give this experiment a try, because I'll probably never get around to it.
ROTT Acronym - Right off the truck. As in, "I got some cigars in the mail today and I was too impatient to give them a proper rest period. I smoked one right off the truck."
I rarely smoke ROTT, I have gotten impatient at times and done so. When I get a shipment, half goes into my smoking humidors and half goes in to my aging humidor.
I wait a couple of weeks and then hit the ones in the smoking humidors. Unscientifically. it has worked for me.
Scrêw it, I'll do it. I have some boxes coming. I don't know if my palate can detect subtle flavor differences, but if all we are talking about are the subtle differences, what's the point?
@Bob_Luken ... that was either a copy/paste or very creative tongue-in-cheek post.
Funny because it's true. Those are actual articles on the subject. I googled "resting cigars shipping cigars" and copy/pasted the titles. I almost included the links.
If you found it on the internet it must be true.
Trapped in the People's Communits Republic of Massachusetts.