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Cuban Storage
PuertoRicoShawn
Posts: 347 ✭✭✭✭
in Cigar 101
I honestly tried searching but guessing I didnt type the correct phrases. While looking at Bovedas I saw mention of the 65 I think it was that was best for Cubans. Are different origin cigars stored at different RH? This doesnt really make sense to me. If so can you explain why? or is this an elitist thing(Cubans are better and must be stored differently?)
When you’re finished changing, you’re finished. —Ben Franklin
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That's the general consensus, or maybe stated more accurately, the phrase that's repeated most often. It may be correct. Whether it's borne out in real life is another story. My palate regarding cigars is average. I don't think I'm capable of saying with any real bearing that cigars do better either way in a small range of humidification.
There are too many variables in cigar smoking to be adamant about anything that narrow as 'Cubans should be 65, non-Cubans should be 69'. My palate can be influenced by a whole host of issues - mood, food, environment, company I smoke with, and on and on; cigars can vary in a given box; pre-conceived ideas on what a stick should taste like - just try smoking something blind; and most of all, how accurate is our measurement of humidity in our storage containers? We can get close, but who knows if 65% is truly 65%.
My typical retort when people start geeking out over small tweaks (I first came into this thinking in the coffee world and espresso enthusiasts making minute changes) is to ask "Can you taste the difference?" I really believe we over-estimate our abilities palate-wise and are over-confident in stating things we can't back up objectively.
All that said, what can it hurt to keep Cubans (I don't smoke them anymore, but that's another story) at 65%, or should I say 'try to keep Cubans at 65%? If you want to be that fussy I say more power to you. Just don't kid yourself that it means anything or at least be humble enough to say you're trying to do what you feel is best, but it could all be nonsense.
Where the cigar came from isn't nearly as important as where it will be smoked. My understanding about Cubans is that they roll them, pack 'em, ship 'em, smoke 'em. So, once rolled, there's not any aging time to speak of. Therefore, one will often find that it's best to let them sit for a few months. Some are reported to be best after 3 or 4 years of rest.
Most cigars do better with rest. If you're ordering decent hand-rolled cigars, I have found it to be advisable to let them rest a month or so prior to smoking, even if they were aged already. Nothing wrong with lighting up one the day you get it, but patience pays.
I had always learned "70/70" was ideal, and in Puerto Rico this may well hold true. That's 70 degrees Fahrenheit, 70% relative humidity. When I got back into cigars around 2008 or so I struggled mightily to achieve these magic numbers, and found that 1) it's hard to do, and 2) it doesn't always work out the way one would expect.
So, I started noticing that a lot of the guys from out West were always saying that they preferred theirs at around 60 - 63%. Think about it, if you're living somewhere where the average daily rH is 20 or 30%, that's a bit of a shock if you're pulling out a cigar that was stored at 70%. I found that mine did best at 63 - 65% here in Tennessee.
Now, that may sound strange, you've lived in TN and you know that it's much more humid than that, but, I usually smoke indoors in an air-conditioned house. Much dryer than outside, especially in the summer months. If I'm planning to smoke one outdoors I usually pick something with a hearty wrapper and set it out in a shady spot for some time before I smoke it.
Something to remember, stability is the key. Whatever % etc. seems to be working for you, try to avoid large fluctuations. A lot of new guys get all hung up on specific numbers and waste a lot of time, money and energy chasing their tail in pursuit of a magic number that turns out not to work for them.
Yes, Boveda is the answer. It's a 2-way system, isotonic. My own method is to use 69% Bovedas with humi-care jars in my humidors, because I like the look and smell of wooden humidors, and this tends to keep my cigars at around 63 to 65%, because wooden humidors always lose moisture. For long term storage I just put the boveda and cigars into sealed plastic, then give them a couple weeks in the wooden humidor before smoking.
Oh, another thing to remember, rH stands for "relative" humidity. If your storage container changes temperature, the rH will change. This does not mean that you have to add moisture, or attempt drying, which could be disastrous. Just get them back to temperature for a little while and things should be fine.
"If you do not read the newspapers you're uninformed. If you do read the newspapers, you're misinformed." -- Mark Twain
I have no such desire thus my question. I have a friend bringing me a couple boxes of Cubans. The last thing that I wish to do is to have to store them separately. I also didn't want to unknowingly mess up my investment but for the life of me I cant understand how something from Cuba would need a different RH then a product from a neighboring island almost at the same latitude and less then 200 miles away.
When you’re finished changing, you’re finished. —Ben Franklin
Good advice, Steve. That makes me want to add something else. We have to understand the nature of cigars, that they're a hand-made natural product, and try as we might, we can't always determine the outcome of any given smoking experience. We can expect great things, but the cigar might not care to cooperate. Some things are simply out of our control. There's much disappointment waiting for the person who expects too much out of anything or anyone or any given cigar.
Given all of that Temperature will be my biggest problem. My house is never near 70 degrees. Generally it is 78-80 with a sea breeze coming in. With a higher standard temp, what then do I do?
When you’re finished changing, you’re finished. —Ben Franklin
Over 70 degrees you have to start worrying about beetles hatching out. You may want to freeze your cigars for a few days when you first get them to kill the eggs and/or larvae. After that, what's wrong with 70 -80? Don't stress about it.
"If you do not read the newspapers you're uninformed. If you do read the newspapers, you're misinformed." -- Mark Twain
The best answer is to evaluate a number of cigars over a period of time, extrapolate an accurate understanding of that evaluation, and only then change something. Where you are and how you experience cigars is hard for an outside observer to advise. You might not have any problem or any need to change anything, but you need to be the one to determine that by evaluating what you're experiencing.
There are some guidelines others will provide, just remember that they're guidelines, subject to your approval, based on your experimenting and evaluating.
Well that sounds awesome! I will research freezing technique.
When you’re finished changing, you’re finished. —Ben Franklin
When you’re finished changing, you’re finished. —Ben Franklin
Found this and it looks interesting. Was on Holts site
When you’re finished changing, you’re finished. —Ben Franklin
How long are the eggs viable? Most of my cigars are several years old. some up to 13 years old. I did just buy a few new sticks so will freeze and quarantine those tonight.
When you’re finished changing, you’re finished. —Ben Franklin
If they’re several years old you don’t have anything to worry about. In the last few years beetles have become much less of a problem than they were before; however, they do still exist. The biggest problems come from areas with a lesser standard of quality control such as Cuba. As far as being viable, they will usually make their presence known within a couple weeks. Like most insects they like warm, moist environments. So once you start pressing for that so-called magical 70/70 you’re crossing the threshold of helping them. Most sticks you buy these days you really don’t have to worry about. Just don’t buy your Cubans on a beach at a great deal. You’ll get burned in more ways than one.
Stuck my new sticks in the freezer just in case. would be heart breaking if I didnt and had them show up.
When you’re finished changing, you’re finished. —Ben Franklin
CI procedure for freezing cigars to kill tobacco beetles:
Empty the entire contents of your humidor and place each cigar in zipped plastic bags.
Seal each bag tightly and place them in your freezer.
After three days, move the bags filled with your cigars into the fridge.
After 24 hours of fridge time, move the cigars back to your humidor.
It is vital that these steps are followed accordingly. Every cigar within the humidor must be addressed - it's better to be safe than sorry. The freezing process is used to kill any beetles or eggs within your cigars. During this time, clean the humidor to remove any remaining beetles or eggs, and return the humidification element.** 24 hours in the fridge will allow the cigars to gradually rise in temperature - an instant increase in temperature could result in cracked or damaged wrappers.**
If you keep your smokes at less than 70/70, the eggs won't hatch if they're there.
Wish i could
When you’re finished changing, you’re finished. —Ben Franklin
Freeze them.
Trapped in the People's Communits Republic of Massachusetts.
I did
When you’re finished changing, you’re finished. —Ben Franklin
One thing I remember reading during my research is that beetles WILL hatch below 70 degrees but it will take them longer to hatch. Yes there would eventually be some point below which the beetles would not hatch, and humidity plays a factor, but 70 degrees is not the absolute lowest hatching temperature range.
I had a beetle problem a few years back. I was able to isolate the troublemakers and figured out which cigars were bad and where they came from, so the infestation was not ongoing. During all that time I studied and searched everything I could find on the subject. Since then, I have had no more trouble and I have gradually relaxed my guard and no longer freeze anything. (I used to freeze everything.) If I have another situation, I'll elevate my defenses again. It's a bit of a hassle to freeze cigars, and I don't do cubans.
I only freeze Cubans. Don't know why. Anything made in Florida could have beetles. Don't know if they freeze them in Florida, or not. Don't imagine they do.
Trapped in the People's Communits Republic of Massachusetts.
From what i have read most seen to
When you’re finished changing, you’re finished. —Ben Franklin
Almost all of the non Cuban manufacturers do, but for varying times with varying results. From what I've read, the lower the temp and the longer you freeze, the better your odds are to kill them.
That in mind, if you freeze them at 4 degrees in your fridge freezer for 3 days, your chance at killing the eggs might be 95 percent. -4 in your chest freezer for 2 weeks might be 99.5. (notional percentages just to illustrate the example)
I've seen a lot of beetle holes in illusione smokes at various shops, and I once got a batch of hot cakes and 3 of them looked like swiss cheese.
I store my Cubans in an airtight container. They only complain for a little while , then not a peep.
Trapped in the People's Communits Republic of Massachusetts.