More on smoking and rights
havanaal
Posts: 155 ✭✭
I find it interesting the number of people here who think restrictions on smoking (especially cigarette smoking) are reasonable, or even necessary. I feel differently, mainly because I see rights as a more black and white issue. That is, I'm a dyed in the wool Libertarian who feels that taking away a right previously enjoyed for centuries is pretty damn serious. Having said that, here's a legitimate question:
I purposely hang out in establishments that allow me to smoke. Lately they're getting harder to find, and I have retreated to the local Indian Reservation/Resort/Casinos where I can smoke virtually anywhere on the property. But as you might imagine there are many people out there who flat out hate the smell of cigar smoke, and make it clear they wish I would go away--I'm sure we're all familiar with the disgusting faces and waving hands. Now, in the old days, I would respect their wishes and go away. But because smokers are under the gun now, I entrench, and ignore them, as if to say "If you don't like the atmosphere, go to the other 99% of public areas around here that are smoke free!" I don't give an inch. Am I being a snob? Am I giving cigar smokers a bad name? How does one be considerate in an atmosphere like this?
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well if we are going to be backed into a figurative corner then the few places we are allowed to smoke in SHOULD be smoked in. The first person waving their hands and making faces I would point out the non-smoking areas to them and stand my ground, which for me is pretty easy to do ...
I dont know, the tax annoys me but...i guess i can live with paying an extra 5 or 6 bucks per 20 sticks if it means a bunch of 6 year olds arent going to be sent up the creek if they get MRSA or something and their parents wont bankrupt themselves to take them in to the doc.
I mean with SCHIP, at least i know exactly where that tax is going.
Pssh, what've kids ever done for me? WHEN DO I GET MY SHARE??!!!
As far as the SCHIP tax.. I don't even know, our government is so screwed up already, lets just throw a few more taxes in to see if we can sort it out...right?
the problem with taxing one group/action to support another is the taxed group will never be able to support the other for the long term. In this case the money from taxing cigars and cigarettes will start to shrink due to people smoking less. even before the tax was there people were smoking less, now many more are considering quitting because of the price of a pack of cigarettes. (itll be about $6.80 ish a pack here in ohio) since there will then be little money from that tax they have to do one of two things:
1) raise the tax on tobacco (this will bring on even less smoking)
or
2) impose a new tax on some other Item.
the cycle will then continue on that item.
the biggest problem with using someone elses money is that you will always run out of someone elses money; either because they actually have no more money or because they are fed up with paying for goods and services of others.
the individual will not endlessly work for the benefit of the masses.
However, I pretty much abhor cigarette smoke and can't stand to be around it. In fact, it got to the point when I went out to bars and was around it, I felt like my reaction was allergic. My eyes would burn and water and it would give me a terrible headache (not the alcohol). When PA banned smoking in restaurants/bars that serve a certain percentage of food, I found going there so much more enjoyable. And I drank more. So I go more frequently and I drink more - they're making up lots of tax revenue there, especiallly since the county where I drink instituted a 1 percent alcohol tax last year to pay for public transportation, which was ridiculous in its own right.
"Long ashes my friends."
First, I don't understand where the government gets the right to tax tobacco and alcohol as much as it does. Since it is not an illegal product it should tax it like any other product if it should tax it at all. The same goes for Gas. Everybody has their hand in that cookie jar. Federal, state, local, all have taxes. Ridiculous! Too much soda can cause health problems too yet soda is taxed at whatever the state tax is. No additional taxes to fund other programs that I know of.
Two, with all the money the government is spending on anti-smoking campaigns they are wasting the money since they are now charging more taxes on tobacco which they hope will fund another campaign. Tobacco is not like alcohol. Too much alcohol can impare judgement so I can understand there being an age limit. As far as I know, tobacco does not impare judgement so it should not have an age limit on it. Not that I want to see young kids smoking but I don't think there should be a limit. This is just another form of control. And I know in a lot of states it used to be 18 to buy cigarettes and now in NJ I believe it is 19. So, at 18 you are legal but you still can not buy tobacco related products until you are 19. So much for being legal.
Three, taxing isn't always the answer. How about spending less money on bullshit stuff! Make our government purchases be worth it and not just throw money at it. The goverment needs to be responsible for its spending just like it wants these companies like AIG to be responsible. The government needs to invest more in our own country. If I remember correctly, we fund other contracts that are outside the US. We NEED to move funding over to US based companies. Now, if the US companies think they can charge more for being American then they need their **** kicked. They need to be resonabale. If they want business they need to be competitive. That goes for companies and employees or should I just say the US workforce. I'm sure there are plenty of jobs out there but Americans have begun to think that certain jobs are below them and those jobs are not good enough for them. Part of that is what has gotten us into this problem with illegals. The illegals will do that job the americans don't want to do and will happily do it because they are making money, and most likely getting paid cash too. So, as much as I would like to see our standard of living be higher I would like to see as many Americans working as possible even if those jobs are not ideal. Sometimes, pride needs to be put aside. Would you rather have a job that pays less and your pride suffers or have no job at all and fail to survive? i would rather bury my pride and get by than loose all my possessions, family, etc... The american workers need to let these people who are hiring illegals know that they are willing to do the job and work just as hard so that it isn't profitable for the illegals to come here anymore. And I have stated this before, anyone caught hiring illegals should be arrested to deter them from doing it in the future. The cost benefit shouldn't be there anymore!
OK, I am done!
Exactly. I was just talking today with a classmate who said he was probably going to quit when they hike the taxes again, as he's already paying around $5 for a pack of Marlboros. The more people that quit, SURPRISE, the less money there is for this genius tax. I'd be willing to bet that they'll go after alcohol next. Or high gas consumption/high emmission vehicles (if they haven't already?).
Oh and speaking of alcohol. Some states or even towns and counties are **** weird when it comes to alcohol laws. In Bergan Country, NJ you can;t by alcohol on Sundays and they are a lot of shops that are closed due to laws. Better yet, I remember my friend was in a supermarket on a Sunday and should could by food but when she went to buy a sponge they wouldn't let her because you can't buy sponges on Sundays.
The following is an excerpt from a testimony given by the Surgeon General in 2003.
"As Surgeon General, I welcome this chance to talk with you about a health crisis affecting every state, every city, every community, and every school across our great nation.
The crisis is obesity. Its the fastest-growing cause of disease and death in America. And its completely preventable.
Nearly two out of every three Americans are overweight or obese. One out of every eight deaths in America is caused by an illness directly related to overweight and obesity."
I will agree that tobacco use raises the risk of certain cancers; I don't think it takes a Rocket Scientist to figure that one out. But if you are concerned with national health, let's look at the big picture. Ban sugar and PHVO before you take down tobacco, and see what that does for national health.
and its not the governments job to keep me healthy.
Cigars today......Nuts tommorow
If we taxed political insanity we could erase the deficit, eliminate world hunger, cure cancer, and put a humidor in every household ........in less than a week ....
I dont eat fast food very often. I still dont think they should be taxed anymore. I dont smoke cigarettes but i dont think they should be taxed anymore. I dont go to bars and drink to the point of self destruction, but i dont think liquor should b taxed more.
the government will always try and fix whatever they feel is a "problem" with taxes. the real problem is the taxes and the government intervention.
just leave me the *** alone. PLEASE