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Cigars. The end?

havanaalhavanaal Posts: 155 ✭✭
in General Discussion
The Family Smoking Prevention and Tobacco Control Act has passed the House. You can read the whole bill on line: http://energycommerce.house.gov/Press_111/20090304/hr1256.pdf Go down to page 135. Taxes are going to triple in the next two years, then contine to go up until the industry is killed. It's been nice---but it's over. (If anyone can find optimism in this legislation, please enlighten us)
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    kuzi16kuzi16 Posts: 14,633 ✭✭✭✭
    see what doing it for the children got us?


    anyone still think that taxes are not a limit on individual liberties?
    Kuzi's Forum Links Page
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    ShawnJShawnJ Posts: 65
    Unfortunately, unless you live in the Bahamas you are gonna pay taxes. However, some nice cigars are rolled in the Bahamas from what I understand......there is a factory at the Atlantis Hotel. Anyone know the name of the brand??
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    iwsmith2iwsmith2 Posts: 65
    Thanks for bringing this to our attention, this is ridiculous.
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    brc81brc81 Posts: 249 ✭
    If all this trash was targeting alcohol sh** should have hit the fan a long time ago, but tobacco users are the current second class citizen. The ignorant masses don't understand the difference between a cigar and a cigarette. Most people, at least those I know, think of a Black & Mild when they think cigar.
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    bass8844bass8844 Posts: 416
    If memory serves me, it's the Graycliff hotel in the Bahamas. Thats the name of the brand as well.
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    kuzi16kuzi16 Posts: 14,633 ✭✭✭✭
    brc81:
    If all this trash was targeting alcohol sh** should have hit the fan a long time ago, but tobacco users are the current second class citizen. The ignorant masses don't understand the difference between a cigar and a cigarette. Most people, at least those I know, think of a Black & Mild when they think cigar.
    as soon as they are done with tobacco it will be on to some other industry. my guess is fast food.
    Kuzi's Forum Links Page
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    kuzi16kuzi16 Posts: 14,633 ✭✭✭✭
    then oil
    Kuzi's Forum Links Page
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    phobicsquirrelphobicsquirrel Posts: 7,347 ✭✭✭
    I didn't read the entire thing but it doesn't really seem to be any different than what is being done right now. I mean there isn't any ads for smoking on tv, in magazines, or billboards. You already can't smoke in schools and restaurants. Now even in bars. I just think it is really dumb that this is even an issue and has been put into a bill. It is really a case of less freedom and more control.
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    bass8844bass8844 Posts: 416
    phobicsquirrel:
    I didn't read the entire thing but it doesn't really seem to be any different than what is being done right now. I mean there isn't any ads for smoking on tv, in magazines, or billboards. You already can't smoke in schools and restaurants. Now even in bars. I just think it is really dumb that this is even an issue and has been put into a bill. It is really a case of less freedom and more control.
    Don't ya love it????They charge more for them, and make it harder for you to enjoy. Pretty soon cigars are going to cost $30 a piece, but you'll only be able to smoke them under a blanket, hiding in your bedroom with the lights turned off!
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    phobicsquirrelphobicsquirrel Posts: 7,347 ✭✭✭
    lol.. Well considering I smoke in my house (garage or patio) 99 percent of the time it being banned at public places isn't that impacting, though not being able to smoke in the park is way overboard and really would pass that line but the way things are going I would not be surprised. I'm just shocked that these types of things are allowed to keep passing. where's the aclu of the tobacco world?? I see this crap as bad as segregating someone on their race, or their intelligence. It's just f-ing wrong.
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    Jetmech_63Jetmech_63 Posts: 3,451 ✭✭✭
    Holy **** dude. How did this pass so quietly? SCHIP got a ton of coverage in the tobacco world...did this one just fly under the radar? Taxation...Representation...WTF man, seriously. I agree with Kooz, taxes are a limitation on personal freedom and liberty. I know everyone has to pay their share but come on. On the outside of the IRS building in DC is inscribed "Taxes are what we pay for a civilized society" I want my effin money back.

    On a side tangent the last time this happened that got me all riled up was when Schwarzenneger quietly banned .50 cal rifles in Kalifornia citing that they could penetrate a bullet proof vest. WTF, the 500 magnum, .44, 460, .454.....i could go on are all legal and can pierce a vest. Hell i can buy 9mm ammo off of 4 sites i can easily name and have it sent to CA that is armor piercing. When the hell was the last time a thug used a 60lb $4,000 rifle to rob a store. Name me one instance in CA and i'll eat my keyboard. I am not a gun control freak, hell i own 18 of em, including a 500 magnum. But i can still buy a .338 laupa mag or a .408 Chey Tac, the latter which comes ungodly close to a .50 ballistics...

    Sorry guys, had to vent.....Whats happening to the country i swore to defend?
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    havanaalhavanaal Posts: 155 ✭✭
    Jetmech_63:
    Holy **** dude. How did this pass so quietly? SCHIP got a ton of coverage in the tobacco world...did this one just fly under the radar? Taxation...Representation...WTF man, seriously. I agree with Kooz, taxes are a limitation on personal freedom and liberty. I know everyone has to pay their share but come on. On the outside of the IRS building in DC is inscribed "Taxes are what we pay for a civilized society" I want my effin money back.

    Economic prohibition. I predict a huge black market. If you have time to read the whole piece of legislation, it's absolutely amazing that this could happen in a supposedly free society. There's even a section on prohibiting "free samples". Guess that means the next time my local dealer throws in a freebie with my purchase, he'll be doing time in Federal prison! And read the part about new smokers being "almost exclusively underaged" That's an insult to all the new smokers on this forum! Your government considers you illegal, whether you are or not is irrelevant.
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    brsmith21brsmith21 Posts: 207
    I would say bring on the black market, but just like prohibition where the quality got really bad and people took whatever they could get, I can't get excited about buying a case of Swishers out of some guy's trunk.
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    PuroFreakPuroFreak Posts: 4,131 ✭✭
    If the day ever comes it will be pretty much the same thing as the Cuban Embargo. Everyone will still be able to get them, it will just cost and arm and a leg and will be hard to come by.
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    KriegKrieg Posts: 5,188 ✭✭✭
    Guess it's time for me to start thinking about building my own tobacco grow house...lol

    "Long ashes my friends."

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    PuroFreakPuroFreak Posts: 4,131 ✭✭
    Krieg:
    Guess it's time for me to start thinking about building my own tobacco grow house...lol
    Hey I found a site where you can order seeds! haha
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    jlzimmermanjlzimmerman Posts: 282
    brsmith21:
    I would say bring on the black market, but just like prohibition where the quality got really bad and people took whatever they could get, I can't get excited about buying a case of Swishers out of some guy's trunk.
    Bingo. As with my firearms, if they ban them I'm not giving them up, same with cigars. People will find a way around laws. This is just another personal liberty that being taken away from professional politicians. And to think how hard our forefathers worked to establish our these freedoms.....
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    kuzi16kuzi16 Posts: 14,633 ✭✭✭✭
    Krieg:
    Guess it's time for me to start thinking about building my own tobacco grow house...lol
    PM me if you are serious.
    Kuzi's Forum Links Page
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    kuzi16kuzi16 Posts: 14,633 ✭✭✭✭
    jlzimmerman:
    brsmith21:
    I would say bring on the black market, but just like prohibition where the quality got really bad and people took whatever they could get, I can't get excited about buying a case of Swishers out of some guy's trunk.
    Bingo. As with my firearms, if they ban them I'm not giving them up, same with cigars. People will find a way around laws. This is just another personal liberty that being taken away from professional politicians. And to think how hard our forefathers worked to establish our these freedoms.....
    ... and its not going to stop here.
    Kuzi's Forum Links Page
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    bigharpoonbigharpoon Posts: 2,963 ✭✭✭
    Our fore-fathers GREW tobacco for God's sake! Along with timber and fish the tabaccee became one of our main cash crops. If it goes the way of the black market we're gonna be sad, anyone ever take a swig of white lightning? Augh.
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    Jetmech_63Jetmech_63 Posts: 3,451 ✭✭✭
    bigharpoon:
    anyone ever take a swig of white lightning? Augh.


    Sheeeit, i make it!!! And it's quite good!
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    smbrinksmbrink Posts: 406 ✭
    Do they think we're stupid? The fact that they used the term "user fee" instead of "tax" is kinda insulting. Or is that the usual term used in acts and the such?
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    rwheelwrightrwheelwright Posts: 3,296 ✭
    Stock up now..........
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    Garen BGaren B Posts: 977
    Great, already breaking my bank to buy cigars, now in a few years I'm going to be paying 45$ for a Swisher Grape?
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    havanaalhavanaal Posts: 155 ✭✭
    smbrink:
    Do they think we're stupid? The fact that they used the term "user fee" instead of "tax" is kinda insulting. Or is that the usual term used in acts and the such?
    They call it a user fee so the Congressman/woman can say "I never voted to raise taxes" during their next campaign.
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    smbrinksmbrink Posts: 406 ✭
    I freaking hate politics. All it is is semantics, hypocrites, and word-games (not the good ones like scrabble and hang man)
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    Matt MarvelMatt Marvel Posts: 930 ✭
    This is just downright ridiculous. I wonder how many lawmakers smoke cigars, or pipes, or even cigarettes? I wouldn't be surprised if it wasn't quite a few. I'm starting to believe that these folks really don't understand that they're going in the opposite direction of where America is supposed to be going. They seem to be pretty damned confused.
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    robert69165robert69165 Posts: 219
    What we need is a lobby group to lobby the senate just like the specail interest groups do! I nominate Kuzi and Bad Andy, I think they would be good lobbyist
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    kuzi16kuzi16 Posts: 14,633 ✭✭✭✭
    robert69165:
    What we need is a lobby group to lobby the senate just like the specail interest groups do! I nominate Kuzi and Bad Andy, I think they would be good lobbyist
    why would i want to be a part of a system that i hate so much?

    Kuzi's Forum Links Page
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    havanaalhavanaal Posts: 155 ✭✭
    kuzi16:
    robert69165:
    What we need is a lobby group to lobby the senate just like the specail interest groups do! I nominate Kuzi and Bad Andy, I think they would be good lobbyist
    why would i want to be a part of a system that i hate so much?

    The average salary for a Washington lobbyist is $128,000, and you don't have to do anything except shake hands and pass out checks.
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