ken it's not just this thread. Or this one time. I am generalizing here, but it is the "way" that the guys who have been around a few years look at this place. There is always remarks about the good old days before UHF and how this place is just not as good as it once was. At some point the new guys get a little self conscious. Then we get a thread like this where anyone with a join date of pre 2011 chimes in on the negative side of things. It semi-forces us to go....wait, am I the issue here?
I agree with this. And I feel like this thread has had its effect in that nature already. its way more quiet in here then normal. everybody is just sitting down and being quiet with one eye on the warden.
I'd love more debate on these forums. I personally do a hell of a lot more reading than I do posting always have probably always will. But I must say I'm definitely seeing a change in the forums now and aside from the everyone agreeing with everyone else on everything there is a ton of fluff posts that add no value to the forum, I'm sorry and I'm not trying to call anyone in particular out but when you're at over a 1,000 posts and you've been here a month or two I can't imagine most of it has value. I'm not trying to say that everything I post has value but I'm not in every thread adding a comment.
this is something i have never understood......what does it hurt if someone posts a +1 or agreed or whatever? I don't understand what it hurts to have those posts in there. Does it have to do with post count and it's relation to respect on the forum because of it?
I'm not saying there's anything wrong with posting a +1 or agreed on a post I've done it myself but that's when I genuinely agree or something I'm not doing it on every other thread to pad my post count, I could care less about my post count I've been on here for a couple years and tons of people still don't know me and that's fine because those who I've interacted with our interaction may have actually had some value, they don't know me because my name pops up in every single thread throughout the day.
Hell, I thought you were DanielReyes a few times I seen you post lol just kidding. I've always wanted to threadjack a post. Back to normal debate guys.
That's happened more than once haha.
Geez I fell for that one too. Totally thought you were the same fella. I think that is a compliment.
ken it's not just this thread. Or this one time. I am generalizing here, but it is the "way" that the guys who have been around a few years look at this place. There is always remarks about the good old days before UHF and how this place is just not as good as it once was. At some point the new guys get a little self conscious. Then we get a thread like this where anyone with a join date of pre 2011 chimes in on the negative side of things. It semi-forces us to go....wait, am I the issue here?
I agree with this. And I feel like this thread has had its effect in that nature already. its way more quiet in here then normal. everybody is just sitting down and being quiet with one eye on the warden.
I'd love more debate on these forums. I personally do a hell of a lot more reading than I do posting always have probably always will. But I must say I'm definitely seeing a change in the forums now and aside from the everyone agreeing with everyone else on everything there is a ton of fluff posts that add no value to the forum, I'm sorry and I'm not trying to call anyone in particular out but when you're at over a 1,000 posts and you've been here a month or two I can't imagine most of it has value. I'm not trying to say that everything I post has value but I'm not in every thread adding a comment.
this is something i have never understood......what does it hurt if someone posts a +1 or agreed or whatever? I don't understand what it hurts to have those posts in there. Does it have to do with post count and it's relation to respect on the forum because of it?
I'm not saying there's anything wrong with posting a +1 or agreed on a post I've done it myself but that's when I genuinely agree or something I'm not doing it on every other thread to pad my post count, I could care less about my post count I've been on here for a couple years and tons of people still don't know me and that's fine because those who I've interacted with our interaction may have actually had some value, they don't know me because my name pops up in every single thread throughout the day.
Hell, I thought you were DanielReyes a few times I seen you post lol just kidding. I've always wanted to threadjack a post. Back to normal debate guys.
Daniel Reyes as in danielzreyes? The jerk that only posts about sock porn, boobies and food ... Daniel Reyes?
And I have learned that some comments are sure to be misinterpreted like I hope to try xyz cigar someday because some of you will think I'm begging to be bombed.
Hey, I finally found something in this thread that I actually want to address!!!! Everyone should absolutely not be afraid to share what it is that they want to try. Personally, I think this should be a big part of the discussion on a cigar forum. I mean, really, most of what I think about in relation to cigars is about what I want to try! I'm not going to refrain from discussing this. Neither should others. In relation to the idea that you are asking to get bombed? I don't care. No one ever sent a bomb that they didn't want to.
And I have learned that some comments are sure to be misinterpreted like I hope to try xyz cigar someday because some of you will think I'm begging to be bombed.
Hey, I finally found something in this thread that I actually want to address!!!! Everyone should absolutely not be afraid to share what it is that they want to try. Personally, I think this should be a big part of the discussion on a cigar forum. I mean, really, most of what I think about in relation to cigars is about what I want to try! I'm not going to refrain from discussing this. Neither should others. In relation to the idea that you are asking to get bombed? I don't care. No one ever sent a bomb that they didn't want to.
i like that too. I like to bomb. If you like to get bombed.... I'll make it so.
And I have learned that some comments are sure to be misinterpreted like I hope to try xyz cigar someday because some of you will think I'm begging to be bombed.
Hey, I finally found something in this thread that I actually want to address!!!! Everyone should absolutely not be afraid to share what it is that they want to try. Personally, I think this should be a big part of the discussion on a cigar forum. I mean, really, most of what I think about in relation to cigars is about what I want to try! I'm not going to refrain from discussing this. Neither should others. In relation to the idea that you are asking to get bombed? I don't care. No one ever sent a bomb that they didn't want to.
i like that too. I like to bomb. If you like to get bombed.... I'll make it so.
matter of fact, let me expound on this. If you want cigars, but don't want every one to know publicly, PM me.. Nobody has to know. It will be between you and me.
Somewhat related, but I was curious. I've seen reference to FOGs a few times. Who are the FOGs? Is it everyone who joined before X date? In this thread alone there are people that joined in every year from 2008 to 2013, so where's the line? I did take a hiatus for about a year and a half or so, was there some divide that happened while I was away that I am unaware of? Obviously I notice quite a few of the regulars from before I slacked off were no longer here, but even when I was active for the first three years or so, people would fall of the face of the earth, so I figured that their absence was just the normaly type of people leaving, only accumulated over a year and a half. Is there some divide between the FOGs and newbies?
Not sure you can put a date on it but I think the divide is highlighted when a FOG says something like - This forum used to be so great, but then new guys joined and they don't behave like I think they should so,........lately,........ the forum sucks. LOL
I vaguely remember that comment being made, and I believe it was the reason a member "left" the forum. My opinion is if you don't like the place you are, go somewhere else. And I say this not to any one person but as a general statement. The forum has grown incredibly since I first found it, and for the most part I enjoy how the continually growing group adds new personality, depth, and knowledge.
This forum is not what it was in 2008, that's fine, Accept or ignore what goes on here. You probably have neighbors or co-workers, or even family members that you are not in agreement with on every issue, every day, how do you deal with them ? Everybody has different ideas of what will make this a better place to be. Some share the idea and some don't.. so be it. Does this place svck, no. I want to continue to be here. As soon as I think it "svcks" I will leave. Without fanfare, and promises to never return, This is an internet forum, don't let it disturb your life..
I feel like this thread is turning into "everyone who thinks something is wrong with the board or with the changes is a big meanie and ganging up on the poor noobs". Again showing the no debate ever everyone must agree thing.
I feel like this thread is turning into "everyone who thinks something is wrong with the board or with the changes is a big meanie and ganging up on the poor noobs". Again showing the no debate ever everyone must agree thing.
I feel like this thread is turning into "everyone who thinks something is wrong with the board or with the changes is a big meanie and ganging up on the poor noobs". Again showing the no debate ever everyone must agree thing.
So in a PM conversation with Brian, I may have come to some clarity in what exactly I was trying to say here...and maybe that'll set some minds at ease...and/or piss off others, but here goes:
The post is about the forum as a whole. The content. The ratio. So no one is to blame. Maybe it's not even something most people are conscious of, and maybe I shouldn't be. But when I log on and see 20 new threads and maybe 2 are meant for more than 5 sets of eyes to look at, I start to worry that we're losing the signal in all the noise. I have NO PROBLEM with the noise. Post +1 until you're blue in the face. But when 3/4 of a thread is people posting +1 and no one's adding anything meaningful to the conversation, the content is ****. Maybe the people more to blame are those that aren't generating enough signal. Maybe some people just need to be more active again and others need to start being more interesting, lol. In posting this I'm talking to EVERYONE, myself included, and in that I'm talking to no one in particular.
One last thing.. When people mention the Old forum members and how they talk about how it used to be here... I believe when ever someone talks about the past, it is a form of nostalgia, like when you find an old photo album or a box of childhood possessions in the attic.. It takes you back to a time that made you happy, or reminds you old friends, people you are no longer in contact with, and you miss those times.. one day, guys who have only been here a short time will look back too, and be just as nostalgic as you see some members are today.. And, the guys who have yet to find this forum will have similar views to your comments when they talk about how things used to be. I remember my grand father, and fathers comments as I was growing up, how great everything was when they were young. They were just recycling the past for more than it was worth, just like I find myself doing now.
One last thing.. When people mention the Old forum members and how they talk about how it used to be here... I believe when ever someone talks about the past, it is a form of nostalgia, like when you find an old photo album or a box of childhood possessions in the attic.. It takes you back to a time that made you happy, or reminds you old friends, people you are no longer in contact with, and you miss those times.. one day, guys who have only been here a short time will look back too, and be just as nostalgic as you see some members are today.. And, the guys who have yet to find this forum will have similar views to your comments when they talk about how things used to be. I remember my grand father, and fathers comments as I was growing up, how great everything was when they were young. They were just recycling the past for more than it was worth, just like I find myself doing now.
brilliant point.
i do not want to stop change. life is change. change is progress.
i do look back on this forum with nostalgia. in nostalgia, everything is perfect. over time the good memories stick around and the crap fades.
i dont feel that the good parts of the forum are going away all together. i do feel that it is different. but i still post here often.
i do feel that i dont belong on some threads though. i do feel unwelcome at times. and i do feel out of place at times too.
thats what im sad about.
i guess i cant expect everyone in the world to like me. that is an unrealistic expectation.
I like you, Kuzi, ya big lug! Now give us a hug and let's get on with our lives...
Years from now, we'll all look back at this thread and think, "Dang! What happened to this place??"
"When I have found intense pain relieved, a weary brain soothed, and calm, refreshing sleep obtained by a cigar, I have felt grateful to God, and have blessed His name." - Charles Haddon Spurgeon
WARNING: The above post may contain thoughts or ideas known to the State of Caliphornia to cause seething rage, confusion, distemper, nausea, perspiration, sphincter release, or cranial implosion to persons who implicitly trust only one news source, or find themselves at either the left or right political extreme. Proceed at your own risk.
"If you do not read the newspapers you're uninformed. If you do read the newspapers, you're misinformed." -- Mark Twain
Somewhat related, but I was curious. I've seen reference to FOGs a few times. Who are the FOGs? Is it everyone who joined before X date? In this thread alone there are people that joined in every year from 2008 to 2013, so where's the line? I did take a hiatus for about a year and a half or so, was there some divide that happened while I was away that I am unaware of? Obviously I notice quite a few of the regulars from before I slacked off were no longer here, but even when I was active for the first three years or so, people would fall of the face of the earth, so I figured that their absence was just the normaly type of people leaving, only accumulated over a year and a half. Is there some divide between the FOGs and newbies?
Not sure you can put a date on it but I think the divide is highlighted when a FOG says something like - This forum used to be so great, but then new guys joined and they don't behave like I think they should so,........lately,........ the forum sucks. LOL
I vaguely remember that comment being made, and I believe it was the reason a member "left" the forum. My opinion is if you don't like the place you are, go somewhere else. And I say this not to any one person but as a general statement. The forum has grown incredibly since I first found it, and for the most part I enjoy how the continually growing group adds new personality, depth, and knowledge.
This forum is not what it was in 2008, that's fine, Accept or ignore what goes on here. You probably have neighbors or co-workers, or even family members that you are not in agreement with on every issue, every day, how do you deal with them ? Everybody has different ideas of what will make this a better place to be. Some share the idea and some don't.. so be it. Does this place svck, no. I want to continue to be here. As soon as I think it "svcks" I will leave. Without fanfare, and promises to never return, This is an internet forum, don't let it disturb your life..
This is not in reply to your stated points (which I agree with) but to clarify my earlier post. It was not a direct quote from any one member but an interpretation of the collective vibe I get from a few FOG's posts from this thread and from old threads too. And I'm not trying to shut down the debate by pointing it out. I'm simply reflecting my take on what is being expressed by a few of the old guys. It was supposed to be a little bit funny and a little bit true.
This thread has been the most interesting thing to happen around here in a while. Lots of opposing viewpoints expressed. But the best part is that everyone who's posted here seems to want the forum to continue to be a great place to hang out and be a welcoming place for new guys.
This thread has been the most interesting thing to happen around here in a while. Lots of opposing viewpoints expressed. But the best part is that everyone who's posted here seems to want the forum to continue to be a great place to hang out and be a welcoming place for new guys.
Wonderful discussion going on, and some of it is based on a self-reflective process.
Why is self reflection important?
Self reflection is important as it helps in personal growth. It offers a great understanding of past events that have occurred in life and it brings you peace with past contemplations that did not satisfy you before. Once these are identified, one is now more able to see how he or she would like to change as a person, how to handle situations differently as well as learning from past mistakes. All in all it helps people to notice your strong and weak points as a person.
I believe that botl's, through this discussion, have made a number of comments that allow for that personal reflection, which if done, will allow the person to either continue with said action, or attempt to change it. Eg. some people dislike the '+1' concept many times; some relive the 'old days' when the forum was different/better; some enjoyed the debate of ideas that used to be much more common (and were able to separate the debate of ideas from the person whom said it).
While i have been following from the beginning, i just re-read the entire thread in an attempt to follow the twists and turns and remind myself of the many views expressed. I suggest that others do as well, as it allowed me a deeper understanding of some of the ideas.
Thanks for reading.
This thread has been the most interesting thing to happen around here in a while. Lots of opposing viewpoints expressed. But the best part is that everyone who's posted here seems to want the forum to continue to be a great place to hang out and be a welcoming place for new guys.
+1... Sorry I had to, but seriously I agree.
And that gentlemen, was my point! Debate is a good thing. I never had an issue with anything else going on. There are a lot of things that I personally don't like or don't want to participate in but they've always been there and its part of the charm.
One last thing.. When people mention the Old forum members and how they talk about how it used to be here... I believe when ever someone talks about the past, it is a form of nostalgia, like when you find an old photo album or a box of childhood possessions in the attic.. It takes you back to a time that made you happy, or reminds you old friends, people you are no longer in contact with, and you miss those times.. one day, guys who have only been here a short time will look back too, and be just as nostalgic as you see some members are today.. And, the guys who have yet to find this forum will have similar views to your comments when they talk about how things used to be. I remember my grand father, and fathers comments as I was growing up, how great everything was when they were young. They were just recycling the past for more than it was worth, just like I find myself doing now.
Well said.
And unlike kuzi and I, kas is actually an FOG. He once told us about the first cigars to hit American shores from Cuba and how when he was young cigars provided just enough light to make it to the outhouse on a moonless night.
One last thing.. When people mention the Old forum members and how they talk about how it used to be here... I believe when ever someone talks about the past, it is a form of nostalgia, like when you find an old photo album or a box of childhood possessions in the attic.. It takes you back to a time that made you happy, or reminds you old friends, people you are no longer in contact with, and you miss those times.. one day, guys who have only been here a short time will look back too, and be just as nostalgic as you see some members are today.. And, the guys who have yet to find this forum will have similar views to your comments when they talk about how things used to be. I remember my grand father, and fathers comments as I was growing up, how great everything was when they were young. They were just recycling the past for more than it was worth, just like I find myself doing now.
Well said.
And unlike kuzi and I, kas is actually an FOG. He once told us about the first cigars to hit American shores from Cuba and how when he was young cigars provided just enough light to make it to the outhouse on a moonless night.
Well Maddie, I don't remember telling the story quite that way, but then again the gaps in memory may be another consequence of being a senior member.
One last thing.. When people mention the Old forum members and how they talk about how it used to be here... I believe when ever someone talks about the past, it is a form of nostalgia, like when you find an old photo album or a box of childhood possessions in the attic.. It takes you back to a time that made you happy, or reminds you old friends, people you are no longer in contact with, and you miss those times.. one day, guys who have only been here a short time will look back too, and be just as nostalgic as you see some members are today.. And, the guys who have yet to find this forum will have similar views to your comments when they talk about how things used to be. I remember my grand father, and fathers comments as I was growing up, how great everything was when they were young. They were just recycling the past for more than it was worth, just like I find myself doing now.
Well said.
And unlike kuzi and I, kas is actually an FOG. He once told us about the first cigars to hit American shores from Cuba and how when he was young cigars provided just enough light to make it to the outhouse on a moonless night.
Well Maddie, I don't remember telling the story quite that way, but then again the gaps in memory may be another consequence of being a senior member.
Good to see you Kas. I'm glad you can still get here at your advanced age. How're the daughters?
Good to see you Kas. I'm glad you can still get here at your advanced age. How're the daughters?
[extreme smart @ss mode] Now see??? This is what we're talking about!! How does this contribute to the discussion of cigars and the advancement of cigar knowledge??? [/extreme smart @ss mode]
"When I have found intense pain relieved, a weary brain soothed, and calm, refreshing sleep obtained by a cigar, I have felt grateful to God, and have blessed His name." - Charles Haddon Spurgeon
Good to see you Kas. I'm glad you can still get here at your advanced age. How're the daughters?
[extreme smart @ss mode] Now see??? This is what we're talking about!! How does this contribute to the discussion of cigars and the advancement of cigar knowledge??? [/extreme smart @ss mode]
I'm terrible and going off topic in a thread once it starts to die. It happens ...
Good to see you Kas. I'm glad you can still get here at your advanced age. How're the daughters?
[extreme smart @ss mode] Now see??? This is what we're talking about!! How does this contribute to the discussion of cigars and the advancement of cigar knowledge??? [/extreme smart @ss mode]
I'm terrible and going off topic in a thread once it starts to die. It happens ...
I do hope you know I was just kidding! LOL!
"When I have found intense pain relieved, a weary brain soothed, and calm, refreshing sleep obtained by a cigar, I have felt grateful to God, and have blessed His name." - Charles Haddon Spurgeon
Comments
One thing.
Thank you. Carry on.
This forum is not what it was in 2008, that's fine, Accept or ignore what goes on here. You probably have neighbors or co-workers, or even family members that you are not in agreement with on every issue, every day, how do you deal with them ? Everybody has different ideas of what will make this a better place to be. Some share the idea and some don't.. so be it. Does this place svck, no. I want to continue to be here. As soon as I think it "svcks" I will leave. Without fanfare, and promises to never return, This is an internet forum, don't let it disturb your life..
The post is about the forum as a whole. The content. The ratio. So no one is to blame. Maybe it's not even something most people are conscious of, and maybe I shouldn't be. But when I log on and see 20 new threads and maybe 2 are meant for more than 5 sets of eyes to look at, I start to worry that we're losing the signal in all the noise. I have NO PROBLEM with the noise. Post +1 until you're blue in the face. But when 3/4 of a thread is people posting +1 and no one's adding anything meaningful to the conversation, the content is ****. Maybe the people more to blame are those that aren't generating enough signal. Maybe some people just need to be more active again and others need to start being more interesting, lol. In posting this I'm talking to EVERYONE, myself included, and in that I'm talking to no one in particular.
brilliant point.
i do not want to stop change. life is change. change is progress.
i do look back on this forum with nostalgia. in nostalgia, everything is perfect. over time the good memories stick around and the crap fades.
i dont feel that the good parts of the forum are going away all together. i do feel that it is different. but i still post here often.
i do feel that i dont belong on some threads though.
i do feel unwelcome at times.
and i do feel out of place at times too.
thats what im sad about.
i guess i cant expect everyone in the world to like me. that is an unrealistic expectation.
Years from now, we'll all look back at this thread and think, "Dang! What happened to this place??"
"If you do not read the newspapers you're uninformed. If you do read the newspapers, you're misinformed." -- Mark Twain
Why is self reflection important?
Self reflection is important as it helps in personal growth. It offers a great understanding of past events that have occurred in life and it brings you peace with past contemplations that did not satisfy you before. Once these are identified, one is now more able to see how he or she would like to change as a person, how to handle situations differently as well as learning from past mistakes. All in all it helps people to notice your strong and weak points as a person.
I believe that botl's, through this discussion, have made a number of comments that allow for that personal reflection, which if done, will allow the person to either continue with said action, or attempt to change it. Eg. some people dislike the '+1' concept many times; some relive the 'old days' when the forum was different/better; some enjoyed the debate of ideas that used to be much more common (and were able to separate the debate of ideas from the person whom said it).
While i have been following from the beginning, i just re-read the entire thread in an attempt to follow the twists and turns and remind myself of the many views expressed. I suggest that others do as well, as it allowed me a deeper understanding of some of the ideas.
Thanks for reading.
And unlike kuzi and I, kas is actually an FOG. He once told us about the first cigars to hit American shores from Cuba and how when he was young cigars provided just enough light to make it to the outhouse on a moonless night.