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  • VisionVision Posts: 8,483 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited October 19

    @IndustMech said:
    @Vision

    Restrictions not equal to elimination

    So then who gets to chose those restrictions, more politicians?

  • VegasFrankVegasFrank Posts: 18,152 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @IndustMech said:
    I remember one of the parties or the other making a big snake about ballots being counted after the polling was over and a bunch of people handling a bunch of ballots.

    I don't know If they had any direct evidence of anything though 😂😂😂😂😂.

    I thought there was a stink about counting ballots that weren't postmarked the day of the election or earlier

    This thing I remember is that they weren't received until after voting day but they were postmarked Before voting day

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  • VegasFrankVegasFrank Posts: 18,152 ✭✭✭✭✭

    And by the way, I would be fine with voter ID requirements if the government would just issue IDs to everybody. Don't know about your state, but here my real ID cost me 50 bucks. There's no option for a non-real ID in Nevada anymore.

    There shouldn't be a $50 entry fee to exercise a basic right. It's not a right at that point, it's a privilege.

    You got to figure out how to let homeless people vote. Before you argue with that, just remember that 13% of the homeless population in the United States of America is comprised of veterans.

    You have to figure out how to let people vote who are in the hospital, or who got arrested that day for a DUI, or who we're on vacation to Disneyland during the off-season, or who are traveling for work, and all the other reasons that mail in ballots exist.

    Maybe none of those homeless veterans or grandmas with lung infections or fun uncles who got arrested in the bar or the family of four who is in California on vacation or the hard-working middle-class person who's at a conference in Omaha matter though?

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  • dirtdudedirtdude Posts: 5,831 ✭✭✭✭✭

    ID requirements are an ignorant plea, you need ID for a six pack, a hotel room, any flight, a pack of smokes, any number of mundane tasks but it's too big of a requirement to vote?

    A little dirt never hurt
  • VegasFrankVegasFrank Posts: 18,152 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited October 20

    @dirtdude said:
    ID requirements are an ignorant plea, you need ID for a six pack, a hotel room, any flight, a pack of smokes, any number of mundane tasks but it's too big of a requirement to vote?

    Yes.

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  • VegasFrankVegasFrank Posts: 18,152 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Why are there requirements to voting? You used to be required to be a landowner. You used to be required to be white. You used to be required to be a man.

    To have a driver's license you have to have a home of record. What about the 200,000 people who defended this country who are now homeless who want to vote? What about people who turned 18 yesterday?

    What about 88-year-old grandma who let her driver's license expire because she doesn't drive anymore and she doesn't take any fukking flights to Cabo and she doesn't get a fishing license and she doesn't buy any six packs?

    I'm just guessing here, but it seems to me that if 80% of the mail in votes and 80% of the non-id votes came from people who are affiliated with Big r, then Big r wouldn't have a problem with it anymore. It's all self-serving bull$hit man.

    It took my wife 3 months and two powers of attorneys and 2 raised seals in two different states to get her real ID because of divorces and name changes. It was compounded by the fact that she doesn't have any utility or mortgage bill coming to the house in her name because everything is in my name.

    It's not a simple **** task that some dummy living in the PJs or some legal non-english speaking poor us citizen can easily accomplish.

    Also, not everybody has 50 bucks Randy. I'm glad that you do and I'm glad that I do.

    Also really poor people deal in 100 percent cash. They don't have credit cards and flights to Cabo and fishing licenses. They buy their six packs at the corner store where they know the clerk from the neighborhood and he doesn't ask for ID, even though it's against the law.

    I also love that there's a large population of people who say everyone should have an ID. When the other side says okay let's give them all IDs, that first side says no.

    They don't actually want them to have IDs to vote. They actually just want them to not vote at all, and the only reason for that is because they think it's likely that these people won't vote for their side.

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  • VegasFrankVegasFrank Posts: 18,152 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Let's make all of our rights a pay to play.

    Right to pursue happiness is at least 20
    Freedom of speech? I'd pay 100.
    Right to a fair trial? 500 easily
    Right to bear arms? 10,000,000 a year

    Yep, I like this idea.

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  • CalvinAndHoboCalvinAndHobo Posts: 3,107 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Out of curiosity, if ID's were free to get, and I offered to remove Columbus day as a federal holiday, and replace it with election day, along with requiring at least 1 polling location per county to be open all 24 hours of the day, would that be considered fair in your eyes? @VegasFrank Is there a way in your world to give everyone a chance to vote, while also making them prove they're the person who's voting?

  • VegasFrankVegasFrank Posts: 18,152 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @CalvinAndHobo I mean I said that if you made IDs free and easy then go ahead and ask for ID. It's that simple. All the other stuff doesn't matter.

    By the way we already have a national ID. It's called a social security card. I'm not navigating in uncharted waters here.

    I don't know why having an election day window instead of one single day in November makes such a big difference to some people.

    Disclaimer:  All trolling is provided for the sole entertainment purposes of the author only. Readers may find entertainment and hard core truths, but none are intended. Any resulting damaged feelings or arse chapping of the reader are the sole responsibility of the reader, to include, but not limited to: crying, anger, revenge pørn, and abandonment or deletion of ccom accounts. Offer void in Utah because Utah is terrible.
  • d_bladesd_blades Posts: 3,973 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @VegasFrank said:
    And by the way, I would be fine with voter ID requirements if the government would just issue IDs to everybody. Don't know about your state, but here my real ID cost me 50 bucks. There's no option for a non-real ID in Nevada anymore.

    There shouldn't be a $50 entry fee to exercise a basic right. It's not a right at that point, it's a privilege.

    You got to figure out how to let homeless people vote. Before you argue with that, just remember that 13% of the homeless population in the United States of America is comprised of veterans.

    You have to figure out how to let people vote who are in the hospital, or who got arrested that day for a DUI, or who we're on vacation to Disneyland during the off-season, or who are traveling for work, and all the other reasons that mail in ballots exist.

    Maybe none of those homeless veterans or grandmas with lung infections or fun uncles who got arrested in the bar or the family of four who is in California on vacation or the hard-working middle-class person who's at a conference in Omaha matter though?

    You don't need a Real I D to vote, most any government id works.

    Don't let the wife know what you spend on guns, ammo or cigars.

  • TRayBTRayB Posts: 2,177 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @VegasFrank said:
    @CalvinAndHobo I mean I said that if you made IDs free and easy then go ahead and ask for ID. It's that simple. All the other stuff doesn't matter.

    By the way we already have a national ID. It's called a social security card. I'm not navigating in uncharted waters here.

    I don't know why having an election day window instead of one single day in November makes such a big difference to some people.

    Non-citizens can get a SS card and be eligible for benefits. Do you believe non-citizens (in any country), whether there legally or not, should be allowed to vote in that country's elections?

  • VisionVision Posts: 8,483 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited October 20

    @TRayB said:

    @VegasFrank said:
    @CalvinAndHobo I mean I said that if you made IDs free and easy then go ahead and ask for ID. It's that simple. All the other stuff doesn't matter.

    By the way we already have a national ID. It's called a social security card. I'm not navigating in uncharted waters here.

    I don't know why having an election day window instead of one single day in November makes such a big difference to some people.

    Non-citizens can get a SS card and be eligible for benefits. Do you believe non-citizens (in any country), whether there legally or not, should be allowed to vote in that country's elections?

    But what if they made them different, some how, some way. Ignore the arrows. Is this a new question you're asking or a response to something I missed?

  • TRayBTRayB Posts: 2,177 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited October 20

    @Vision said:

    @TRayB said:

    @VegasFrank said:
    @CalvinAndHobo I mean I said that if you made IDs free and easy then go ahead and ask for ID. It's that simple. All the other stuff doesn't matter.

    By the way we already have a national ID. It's called a social security card. I'm not navigating in uncharted waters here.

    I don't know why having an election day window instead of one single day in November makes such a big difference to some people.

    Non-citizens can get a SS card and be eligible for benefits. Do you believe non-citizens (in any country), whether there legally or not, should be allowed to vote in that country's elections?

    But what if they made them different, some how, some way. Ignore the arrows.

    Have you ever actually shown your SS card to anyone for proof of ID, or have you just written your SS# on application forms, etc.? I have never shown mine.

  • VisionVision Posts: 8,483 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @TRayB said:

    @Vision said:

    @TRayB said:

    @VegasFrank said:
    @CalvinAndHobo I mean I said that if you made IDs free and easy then go ahead and ask for ID. It's that simple. All the other stuff doesn't matter.

    By the way we already have a national ID. It's called a social security card. I'm not navigating in uncharted waters here.

    I don't know why having an election day window instead of one single day in November makes such a big difference to some people.

    Non-citizens can get a SS card and be eligible for benefits. Do you believe non-citizens (in any country), whether there legally or not, should be allowed to vote in that country's elections?

    But what if they made them different, some how, some way. Ignore the arrows.

    Have you ever actually shown your SS card to anyone for proof of ID, or have you just written your SS# on application forms, etc.? I have never shown mine.

    If you knew me, you would know my wife is in charge of that stuff. Without her, I would forget to put on underwear in the morning.

  • TRayBTRayB Posts: 2,177 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Vision said:

    @TRayB said:

    @Vision said:

    @TRayB said:

    @VegasFrank said:
    @CalvinAndHobo I mean I said that if you made IDs free and easy then go ahead and ask for ID. It's that simple. All the other stuff doesn't matter.

    By the way we already have a national ID. It's called a social security card. I'm not navigating in uncharted waters here.

    I don't know why having an election day window instead of one single day in November makes such a big difference to some people.

    Non-citizens can get a SS card and be eligible for benefits. Do you believe non-citizens (in any country), whether there legally or not, should be allowed to vote in that country's elections?

    But what if they made them different, some how, some way. Ignore the arrows.

    Have you ever actually shown your SS card to anyone for proof of ID, or have you just written your SS# on application forms, etc.? I have never shown mine.

    If you knew me, you would know my wife is in charge of that stuff. Without her, I would forget to put on underwear in the morning.

    Deflection.

    The question was mainly rhetorical. Beyond the fact that most people (as you imply) do not even know where their physical SS card is, they aren't really to be used identification (there's no photo, after all), but are solely to be used for transactions between you and the government (political parties are not part of the government, and have no right to demand SS #s).

    The question still remains, should non-citizens (in any country), whether there legally or not, be allowed to vote in that country's elections?

  • silvermousesilvermouse Posts: 20,846 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited October 20

    Billionaire buying petition signers, it's legal.

    "The petition was launched by Musk's America PAC, a super PAC he created to support Trump using around $75 million of his own funds."

    The PAC was created to "support candidates who champion Secure Borders, Sensible Spending, Safe Cities, Fair Justice System, Free Speech and Self-Protection," according to its bio on X.

    https://x.com/america/status/1847851986495881434?ref_src=twsrc^tfw|twcamp^tweetembed|twterm^1847851986495881434|twgr^d9cb22a0ae3e8333ce609e460bf119eb6fb3da43|twcon^s1_c10&ref_url=https://www.msn.com/en-us/money/companies/elon-musk-gives-random-petition-signer-a-1m-check-as-he-announces-million-dollar-handouts-in-swing-states/ar-AA1sAqJc?ocid=nl_article_link

  • Bob_LukenBob_Luken Posts: 10,734 ✭✭✭✭✭

    In the current political landscape, Dems benefit from the vote cheaters. Reps benefit from less vote cheating.
    Might as well keep it as simple as possible.

  • VegasFrankVegasFrank Posts: 18,152 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited October 20

    @d_blades you can't not get a real ID here. I tried.

    @TRayB yes I did have to show it. To get my first driver's license (I had to bring my birth certificate too). everyone prolly did, I guess. As a matter of fact, a driver's license is a confirmation that you have 2 other forms of id. If people could use it as id, then they wouldn't not know where it is.

    I guess the question was rhetorical because you knew the answer was yes?

    @Bob_Luken the simplest way is to not have id.

    Why are people against free ID cards?

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  • ShawnOLShawnOL Posts: 9,553 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I have no problem with free ID. Let the politicians pay for it.

    Trapped in the People's Communist Republic of Massachusetts.

  • TRayBTRayB Posts: 2,177 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited October 20

    @VegasFrank said:
    @d_blades you can't not get a real ID here. I tried.

    @TRayB yes I did have to show it. To get my first driver's license (I had to bring my birth certificate too). everyone prolly did, I guess. As a matter of fact, a driver's license is a confirmation that you have 2 other forms of id. If people could use it as id, then they wouldn't not know where it is.

    ** I guess the question was rhetorical because you knew the answer was yes?**

    @Bob_Luken the simplest way is to not have id.

    Why are people against free ID cards?

    The question wasn't rhetorical. I don't recall having to show my SS card to get a driver's license, but that was 41 years ago. Maybe I just don't remember. Beyond that, I don't remember any other time having to show my physical SS card for anything. Just provide the number, which is memorized.

    I am not against free ID cards. If the .gov is going to require ID, then it should be provided free of charge.

    So, you haven't answered my question, now thrice repeated: Should non-citizens (in any country), whether there legally or not, be allowed to vote in that country's elections? That is the crux of the ID question.

  • d_bladesd_blades Posts: 3,973 ✭✭✭✭✭

    The fee for a Real ID only (Change of Information) is $8.25 for a driver license, $7.25 for an ID card or $12.25 for a commercial license. Other driver license/ID changes of information, such as an address change or name change, may be included with no additional fee.

    There is no additional charge for a Real ID if you are completing another license/ID transaction such as a renewal or adding an endorsement.

    From the Nevada DMV site.

    Don't let the wife know what you spend on guns, ammo or cigars.

  • Bob_LukenBob_Luken Posts: 10,734 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited October 20

    @VegasFrank said:
    @d_blades you can't not get a real ID here. I tried.

    @TRayB yes I did have to show it. To get my first driver's license (I had to bring my birth certificate too). everyone prolly did, I guess. As a matter of fact, a driver's license is a confirmation that you have 2 other forms of id. If people could use it as id, then they wouldn't not know where it is.

    I guess the question was rhetorical because you knew the answer was yes?

    @Bob_Luken the simplest way is to not have id.

    Why are people against free ID cards?

    Stop lyin' about what I'm thinkin'. I love the idea of free ID cards for people who have none currently, i.e, non-functional citizens.

  • VegasFrankVegasFrank Posts: 18,152 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited October 20

    @d_blades said:
    The fee for a Real ID only (Change of Information) is $8.25 for a driver license, $7.25 for an ID card or $12.25 for a commercial license. Other driver license/ID changes of information, such as an address change or name change, may be included with no additional fee.

    There is no additional charge for a Real ID if you are completing another license/ID transaction such as a renewal or adding an endorsement.

    From the Nevada DMV site.

    I paid 50 bucks 5 years ago. Glad it changed. Let's make IDs free. Or no?

    As you said that was for a change of information ID. To get one for the first time, which is what I did, it was 50 bucks. From my banking account.

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  • VegasFrankVegasFrank Posts: 18,152 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @TRayB said:

    @VegasFrank said:
    @d_blades you can't not get a real ID here. I tried.

    @TRayB yes I did have to show it. To get my first driver's license (I had to bring my birth certificate too). everyone prolly did, I guess. As a matter of fact, a driver's license is a confirmation that you have 2 other forms of id. If people could use it as id, then they wouldn't not know where it is.

    ** I guess the question was rhetorical because you knew the answer was yes?**

    @Bob_Luken the simplest way is to not have id.

    Why are people against free ID cards?

    The question wasn't rhetorical. I don't recall having to show my SS card to get a driver's license, but that was 41 years ago. Maybe I just don't remember. Beyond that, I don't remember any other time having to show my physical SS card for anything. Just provide the number, which is memorized.

    I am not against free ID cards. If the .gov is going to require ID, then it should be provided free of charge.

    So, you haven't answered my question, now thrice repeated: Should non-citizens (in any country), whether there legally or not, be allowed to vote in that country's elections? That is the crux of the ID question.

    Oh, I thought you said that the question was rhetorical above. You literally said it was rhetorical.

    I don't answer stupid questions. It's a fuçking dumb question.

    Tell you what, I'll answer your question after you answer this one: do you think it's bad for first graders to get shot by madmen with their mom's AR??

    Disclaimer:  All trolling is provided for the sole entertainment purposes of the author only. Readers may find entertainment and hard core truths, but none are intended. Any resulting damaged feelings or arse chapping of the reader are the sole responsibility of the reader, to include, but not limited to: crying, anger, revenge pørn, and abandonment or deletion of ccom accounts. Offer void in Utah because Utah is terrible.
  • VegasFrankVegasFrank Posts: 18,152 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @VegasFrank said:

    @d_blades said:
    The fee for a Real ID only (Change of Information) is $8.25 for a driver license, $7.25 for an ID card or $12.25 for a commercial license. Other driver license/ID changes of information, such as an address change or name change, may be included with no additional fee.

    There is no additional charge for a Real ID if you are completing another license/ID transaction such as a renewal or adding an endorsement.

    From the Nevada DMV site.

    I paid 50 bucks 5 years ago. Glad it changed. Let's make IDs free. Or no?

    As you said that was for a change of information ID. To get one for the first time, which is what I did, it was 50 bucks. From my banking account.

    I just searched my bank transactions. My daughter's driver's license was $32.50. she was required to bring her birth certificate and social security card. I had to bring a bill and my driver's license proving that I was her parent and that I lived at the address. Sounds pretty easy for a non-english speaker or a homeless person to do.

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  • VegasFrankVegasFrank Posts: 18,152 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Bob_Luken said:

    @VegasFrank said:
    @d_blades you can't not get a real ID here. I tried.

    @TRayB yes I did have to show it. To get my first driver's license (I had to bring my birth certificate too). everyone prolly did, I guess. As a matter of fact, a driver's license is a confirmation that you have 2 other forms of id. If people could use it as id, then they wouldn't not know where it is.

    I guess the question was rhetorical because you knew the answer was yes?

    @Bob_Luken the simplest way is to not have id.

    Why are people against free ID cards?

    Stop lyin' about what I'm thinkin'. I love the idea of free ID cards for people who have none currently, i.e, non-functional citizens.

    I wasn't talking about you. I said the proverbial people! Everyone knows you're not a person. 😂

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  • VegasFrankVegasFrank Posts: 18,152 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Because you're a god ^

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  • Bob_LukenBob_Luken Posts: 10,734 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Well then, I (whom you call a god) decree that idiots shall not vote. You Frank, shall produce a "nonpolitical" simple test by Monday morning to weed out the idiots.
    Now we're gettin' somewhere.

  • VisionVision Posts: 8,483 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @TRayB said:

    @Vision said:

    @TRayB said:

    @Vision said:

    @TRayB said:

    @VegasFrank said:
    @CalvinAndHobo I mean I said that if you made IDs free and easy then go ahead and ask for ID. It's that simple. All the other stuff doesn't matter.

    By the way we already have a national ID. It's called a social security card. I'm not navigating in uncharted waters here.

    I don't know why having an election day window instead of one single day in November makes such a big difference to some people.

    Non-citizens can get a SS card and be eligible for benefits. Do you believe non-citizens (in any country), whether there legally or not, should be allowed to vote in that country's elections?

    But what if they made them different, some how, some way. Ignore the arrows.

    Have you ever actually shown your SS card to anyone for proof of ID, or have you just written your SS# on application forms, etc.? I have never shown mine.

    If you knew me, you would know my wife is in charge of that stuff. Without her, I would forget to put on underwear in the morning.

    Deflection.

    The question was mainly rhetorical. Beyond the fact that most people (as you imply) do not even know where their physical SS card is, they aren't really to be used identification (there's no photo, after all), but are solely to be used for transactions between you and the government (political parties are not part of the government, and have no right to demand SS #s).

    The question still remains, should non-citizens (in any country), whether there legally or not, be allowed to vote in that country's elections?

    Nope, not deflection. Pretty sure I had to bring it when I signed up for TSA Pre-Check. Pretty sure it's also still in the safe where it was when it was put back. The comment on if you knew me was a direct shot at you because you seem to take part in about two types of threads. Contests and politics. Try the vHerf once in a while and get to actually know people.

  • TRayBTRayB Posts: 2,177 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @VegasFrank said:

    @TRayB said:

    @VegasFrank said:
    @d_blades you can't not get a real ID here. I tried.

    @TRayB yes I did have to show it. To get my first driver's license (I had to bring my birth certificate too). everyone prolly did, I guess. As a matter of fact, a driver's license is a confirmation that you have 2 other forms of id. If people could use it as id, then they wouldn't not know where it is.

    ** I guess the question was rhetorical because you knew the answer was yes?**

    @Bob_Luken the simplest way is to not have id.

    Why are people against free ID cards?

    The question wasn't rhetorical. I don't recall having to show my SS card to get a driver's license, but that was 41 years ago. Maybe I just don't remember. Beyond that, I don't remember any other time having to show my physical SS card for anything. Just provide the number, which is memorized.

    I am not against free ID cards. If the .gov is going to require ID, then it should be provided free of charge.

    So, you haven't answered my question, now thrice repeated: Should non-citizens (in any country), whether there legally or not, be allowed to vote in that country's elections? That is the crux of the ID question.

    Oh, I thought you said that the question was rhetorical above. You literally said it was rhetorical.

    I don't answer stupid questions. It's a fuçking dumb question.

    Tell you what, I'll answer your question after you answer this one: do you think it's bad for first graders to get shot by madmen with their mom's AR??

    The rhetorical question I was referring to was the question to Pete about having to show a SS card, not whether non-citizens should be allowed to vote.

    Yes, I do think it is bad for first grader's to get shot by anyone, with any gun.

    Your turn. It is not a dumb question. As I said, it is the crux of the ID argument. (You know it, I know it, and everyone here on this forum knows it.)

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