@Vision said:
Teachers teach your kids….. your kids. Don’t like public, send em to private…. Don’t like (or can afford) private …. Stay home and home school.
>
Kids get better grades in private school, at least around here, because the parents are paying for their education and the principal's pressure teachers to change grades, not that this doesn't happen in public schools too but at least there you have a leg to stand on regarding the integrity of your gradebook.
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@Amos_Umwhat said:
I think I passed through a corner of North Carolina once in the 60's. Up until that day all my school experience was with the school system in Brooklyn New York. I guess we ALL make incorrect assumptions sometimes, probably based on not knowing the facts.
Attention to detail would show, as per the top of my post, that I now live in West TN. Just
You are so right! Everything that I've ever said is completely invalid because I said you were from a different part of the country you actually were. I'll go kill myself now.
Well, you know, when you spot a trend...we'll miss you, Frank.
WARNING: The above post may contain thoughts or ideas known to the State of Caliphornia to cause seething rage, confusion, distemper, nausea, perspiration, sphincter release, or cranial implosion to persons who implicitly trust only one news source, or find themselves at either the left or right political extreme. Proceed at your own risk.
"If you do not read the newspapers you're uninformed. If you do read the newspapers, you're misinformed." -- Mark Twain
@Amos_Umwhat said:
I think I passed through a corner of North Carolina once in the 60's. Up until that day all my school experience was with the school system in Brooklyn New York. I guess we ALL make incorrect assumptions sometimes, probably based on not knowing the facts.
Attention to detail would show, as per the top of my post, that I now live in West TN. Just
You are so right! Everything that I've ever said is completely invalid because I said you were from a different part of the country you actually were. I'll go kill myself now.
Well, you know, when you spot a trend...we'll miss you, Frank.
Liar! 😆
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The point to this is that perhaps this kind of discrepancy from state to state was a reason for uniform testing across the country.
In case the point got missed.
Much of what Frank has said about the problems with the standardized approach is quite correct, I think, but there are also some good reasons for standardized tests. Are they all good? No, I don't think so. So, the point made above is obvious, making sure that kids all across the country have certain basic knowledge and skills.
What can we agree on? How about that we should continually evaluate education? We should consider other approaches, etc., that might improve outcomes, and these may be other than standardized tests. I'm good with considering that.
One idea I had, long ago, was to divide the 12 year system into 4 blocks. First, second, third grade and so forth. The idea here will be that kids develop differently sometimes. So, going into the 4th grade, say, let the kid take classes that he's interested in, save the ones he's not quite ready for until later in the block.
But, I'm wandering from the point. How about another thing we might agree on, that the purpose of schooling should be to prepare the students for real life after their mandatory 12 years. I know, it's not exactly mandatory, but you should get my meaning here.
So, after High School graduation, what then? College? Hmm, they're going to require some things, like the ACT or SAT, standardized tests. What if they go to college and study something like Nursing? You have to pass the NCLEX to get your license. Standardized test. How about Med School? GMAT. Law School? LSAT.
Perhaps a standardized test along the way, say, to graduate High School might help?
Or, what's the better idea?
WARNING: The above post may contain thoughts or ideas known to the State of Caliphornia to cause seething rage, confusion, distemper, nausea, perspiration, sphincter release, or cranial implosion to persons who implicitly trust only one news source, or find themselves at either the left or right political extreme. Proceed at your own risk.
"If you do not read the newspapers you're uninformed. If you do read the newspapers, you're misinformed." -- Mark Twain
@webmost said:
Perhaps we're looking at the test from the wrong side.
Perhaps such a test could evaluate of teacher competency.
Of course, teachers would just make a slew of excuses, as they do now: parents, society, low pay, pupil behavior, drugs, distractions, etc. etc. In every other job, you have to find a way. Teaching, you merely find an excuse.
What if these exams were a way to test teachers?
Do you just spit nonsense to get a reaction? In Massachusetts you need a Master’s Degree to teach. And yes they have tests, and evaluations, and trainings, and more schooling……. Excuses…… you have no idea. Teachers teach your kids….. your kids. Don’t like public, send em to private…. Don’t like (or can afford) private …. Stay home and home school.
@Amos_Umwhat there's a lot to unpack here. Let me try:
Standardized tests were a byproduct of anecdotal evidence that illiterate students were receiving high school diplomas. Then we tied funding to them, which make them much worse and much less accurate of an assessment. It was the opposite of a bandaid on bullet hole. It was a tourniquet on a paper cut. Now instead of getting a high school diploma, these illiterate kids are getting certificates of attendance. We didn't solve the problem. We just identified it. In many ways, we made it worse.
Continually evaluating education as a great idea, but unfortunately we don't know how to do that. We don't know what measures to use and how to apply them. We don't know how to test for outliers. We don't know how to address identified problems. I'm all ears when it comes to ideas. But big government butting into local government business is not the answer. Look, I'm conservative now!
Your division is an interesting idea. Few flaws though. I'm not criticizing, by the way. First, there are 13 grades not 12. Second, who says 12 grades is the right answer? I know everybody does, but that doesn't mean it's right. Third, schools are divided into specialties of teaching and kids who are like each other. We took ninth grade out of "junior high" and invented middle schools because 6th graders were more like 8th graders than 7th were 9th. K through 3 is defined as early childhood education, which is a specialty of education in many states. There's a lot of psychological, physiological, and developmental data to support this theory. K through 5 is the way it is because you have all prepubescent children as a population. If you start mixing populations, you may introduce unintended problems.
As the parent of 2 current 6th graders and an 8th grader, I can tell you that 5 6 7 and 8 graders in the same school is a problem for the young ones. Plus, you have already built schools for specific populations and you might overcrowd some and leave others underpopulated. That ship has probably sailed, pragmatically.
There's a myth that Bernie Sanders and the left is perpetuating. That myth is that college is for everybody. Wrong. As a college instructor married to a tenured professor, I can tell you that nothing could be further from the truth. Look, still conservative!
Sure you have your SAT and ACT, beacons of light in the standardized testing world. Know why those work and Tony's HS reading test don't? There are 20 reasons, but the top reason is that the test creating organizations ACT and ETS, are private entities that rely on their reputations amongst academia to continue to make money for their shareholders. When the test becomes irrelevant, colleges stop considering those scores, and the tests die.
Yes, all kinds of tests are required for all kinds of professions. You forgot that teachers have to take the praxis. Of course, they have 2 years of teaching before they have to even TAKE the praxis, then they get like 4 shots at passing it. Difference is that they're all academics AND adults.
Way different than a test to get a diploma from a system that failed you for 13 years. Kids don't learn to read and multiply in high school (okay, maybe "multiply" lol).
That's my starting point. We can argue from there.
Disclaimer: All trolling is provided for the sole entertainment purposes of the author only. Readers may find entertainment and hard core truths, but none are intended. Any resulting damaged feelings or arse chapping of the reader are the sole responsibility of the reader, to include, but not limited to: crying, anger, revenge pørn, and abandonment or deletion of ccom accounts. Offer void in Utah because Utah is terrible.
Standardized tests were a byproduct of anecdotal evidence that illiterate students were receiving high school diplomas. Then we tied funding to them, which make them much worse and much less accurate of an assessment. It was the opposite of a bandaid on bullet hole. It was a tourniquet on a paper cut. Now instead of getting a high school diploma, these illiterate kids are getting certificates of attendance. We didn't solve the problem. We just identified it. In many ways, we made it worse.
Agreed. You've elaborated on one of the things I was referring to when I said I thought you were right about many problems with the mandated test.
Continually evaluating education as a great idea, but unfortunately we don't know how to do that. We don't know what measures to use and how to apply them. We don't know how to test for outliers. We don't know how to address identified problems. I'm all ears when it comes to ideas. But big government butting into local government business is not the answer. Look, I'm conservative now!
I thought this was the question I was asking, perhaps I wasn't clear.
Your division is an interesting idea. Few flaws though. I'm not criticizing, by the way. First, there are 13 grades not 12. Second, who says 12 grades is the right answer? I know everybody does, but that doesn't mean it's right. Third, schools are divided into specialties of teaching and kids who are like each other. We took ninth grade out of "junior high" and invented middle schools because 6th graders were more like 8th graders than 7th were 9th. K through 3 is defined as early childhood education, which is a specialty of education in many states. There's a lot of psychological, physiological, and developmental data to support this theory. K through 5 is the way it is because you have all prepubescent children as a population. If you start mixing populations, you may introduce unintended problems.
I figured Kindergarten to simply stay Kindergarten. In Alaska, I was in a "Junior HS" with 7th - 9th graders. The next year I was in a 5th - 8th grade "middle school". I'm familiar with the problems, which is probably what spawned my idea of 4 divisions after Kindergarten.
As the parent of 2 current 6th graders and an 8th grader, I can tell you that 5 6 7 and 8 graders in the same school is a problem for the young ones. Plus, you have already built schools for specific populations and you might overcrowd some and leave others underpopulated. That ship has probably sailed, pragmatically.
Yeah, as above, there's a problem. Societal direction would have to change.
There's a myth that Bernie Sanders and the left is perpetuating. That myth is that college is for everybody. Wrong. As a college instructor married to a tenured professor, I can tell you that nothing could be further from the truth. Look, still conservative!
You may have read my comments on this before. I've said many times that many kids should not be going to college. They're not ready. I used my time as an Army recruiter trying to get that across to many parents. "Your son/daughter may one day do well in college, but right now all they'll accomplish is changing beer into urine." As tactfully as possible.
Sure you have your SAT and ACT, beacons of light in the standardized testing world. Know why those work and Tony's HS reading test don't? There are 20 reasons, but the top reason is that the test creating organizations ACT and ETS, are private entities that rely on their reputations amongst academia to continue to make money for their shareholders. When the test becomes irrelevant, colleges stop considering those scores, and the tests die.
Good idea. Independent entities competing to provide standards that are meaningful. Perhaps these should be employed in creating the H.S. graduation tests.
Yes, all kinds of tests are required for all kinds of professions. You forgot that teachers have to take the praxis. Of course, they have 2 years of teaching before they have to even TAKE the praxis, then they get like 4 shots at passing it. Difference is that they're all academics AND adults.
I didn't forget that, it was never meant to be a comprehensive list, just enough information for the idea to be clearly understood.
Way different than a test to get a diploma from a system that failed you for 13 years. Kids don't learn to read and multiply in high school (okay, maybe "multiply" lol).
Again, agreed.
That's my starting point. We can argue from there.
WARNING: The above post may contain thoughts or ideas known to the State of Caliphornia to cause seething rage, confusion, distemper, nausea, perspiration, sphincter release, or cranial implosion to persons who implicitly trust only one news source, or find themselves at either the left or right political extreme. Proceed at your own risk.
"If you do not read the newspapers you're uninformed. If you do read the newspapers, you're misinformed." -- Mark Twain
So what are the answers Frank?
When you have kids come out of high school and it takes them 20 minutes to do simple equations for a tape measurer, let alone attempt any kinds of general calculations that are required in most trades.
How do you propose to fix the problem?
When you see people posting on Fakebook, who are in their mid 20s and quite a few can't spell or construct simple sentences with correct grammar, something is very wrong.
What exactly does this mean?
Is it some attempt at a dig on my intelligence?
Know why those work and Tony's HS reading test don't?
In Fumo Pax Money can't buy happiness, but it can buy cigars and that's close enough.
@0patience said:
So what are the answers Frank?
When you have kids come out of high school and it takes them 20 minutes to do simple equations for a tape measurer, let alone attempt any kinds of general calculations that are required in most trades.
How do you propose to fix the problem?
When you see people posting on Fakebook, who are in their mid 20s and quite a few can't spell or construct simple sentences with correct grammar, something is very wrong.
What exactly does this mean?
Is it some attempt at a dig on my intelligence?
Know why those work and Tony's HS reading test don't?
Oh for chrissake Tony, I wasn't digging at your intelligence. I was referring to the story from YOUR state that YOU posted, hence "Tony's." I think that everyone else who read that had zero inclination that I was digging on your intelligence.
If you're that defensive that you search phrases to find something offensive, then I don't know how we can have a conversation.
You ask how to solve your (as in you brought it up just now, not as in you're not intelligent) problem of the tape measure, but you (Oregon, not your intelligence) had the test last year and for the 30 years before and your (Oregon) people can't measure after 30 years of exit testing, so clearly the test didn't get you (Oregon) to where you (tony) wanted to be.
This, by the way, is called "coming full circle" because it's the very first point made to start this whole thing. And guess what? You proved it.
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Hmm. Ok.
Again, you didn't answer the question.
You find flaws in all of it, but offer no correction.
You'd make a terrible mechanic.
How can you determine adequate learning without some form of testing?
In work environments, some testing is hands on, which shows competent work.
Can't do that with schooling.
I know, what is my suggestion.
I'm not a school teacher, so I won't even offer suggestions. You'd find them wrong anyways.
I'd put the smilies and stuff, but you made it clear I wasn't using them as intended.
In Fumo Pax Money can't buy happiness, but it can buy cigars and that's close enough.
I think where we are disconnected is vocabulary. Yes, tests should be a part of education. We are on the same page there.
But the end of high school, all encompassing test is a waste of time to me. That's the test I'd like to get rid of.
Just that one.
I do have solutions to propose, but they're not easy or cheap. I can share them:
Reduce class sizes. Elementary should be no more than 30. Middle school too. HS can be more for lecture classes like history, but not for application classes like math and English. This will allow teachers to spend more individual time with students that need extra help.
True professional development for teachers, most to occur on July and August,when teachers are not teaching. This will actually teach teachers how to teach, which isn't what they learn in college today. Today, they get a basic lib arts degree, take the licensing test which is a farce, and fingerprints. Then it's off to teach future generations. Wrong!that's like a guy getting a math degree and then telling him to go design a spaceship. This leads me to my next one:
Increase teacher pay. Call it because of the 12 month work year. Call it because of the extra training that turns them from educated workers to a highly trained and educated workforce. The extra pay will make more people want to become teachers, increasing competition and resulting in a higher quality workforce.
Actual in class teaching assessments with critiques and assessments. Like NFL players watching game film on Tuesday. Learn from your mistakes. Have accountability. This would require union busting. As a matter of fact, all of these would require union busting.
Hire supervisors (i.e. principals) who have professional supervisory education, training, and or experience. Quit hiring 20 year teachers because they put in their time and went to night school for their MEd. Put people on those positions who know how to handle a staff of 50 and a student body of 900.
Let's see where those 5 get us, then we'll talk about an exit exam.
Disclaimer: All trolling is provided for the sole entertainment purposes of the author only. Readers may find entertainment and hard core truths, but none are intended. Any resulting damaged feelings or arse chapping of the reader are the sole responsibility of the reader, to include, but not limited to: crying, anger, revenge pørn, and abandonment or deletion of ccom accounts. Offer void in Utah because Utah is terrible.
Disclaimer: All trolling is provided for the sole entertainment purposes of the author only. Readers may find entertainment and hard core truths, but none are intended. Any resulting damaged feelings or arse chapping of the reader are the sole responsibility of the reader, to include, but not limited to: crying, anger, revenge pørn, and abandonment or deletion of ccom accounts. Offer void in Utah because Utah is terrible.
@VegasFrank
Well done, my friend.
I cannot find flaw in any of those points.
I graduated early, with all my requirements done, as I turned 17.
There were several organizations that were instrumental in making that happen. Tests were just that. Stepping stones to change a poor kid's life.
So I cannot say they had been a waste of time for me. It was a complicated web. 🤣
In Fumo Pax Money can't buy happiness, but it can buy cigars and that's close enough.
I had the "credits" required for graduation at the end of my junior year, but it was against policy to actually let me out of school. So my senior year was Band, three shop classes, a vocational class(VICA?) , then got out to work for 1/2 a day.
Post edited by d_blades on
Don't let the wife know what you spend on guns, ammo or cigars.
@silvermouse said:
i graduated with a D- average and high SATs. Terrible student, good learner.
Same here
WARNING: The above post may contain thoughts or ideas known to the State of Caliphornia to cause seething rage, confusion, distemper, nausea, perspiration, sphincter release, or cranial implosion to persons who implicitly trust only one news source, or find themselves at either the left or right political extreme. Proceed at your own risk.
"If you do not read the newspapers you're uninformed. If you do read the newspapers, you're misinformed." -- Mark Twain
@silvermouse said:
i graduated with a D- average and high SATs. Terrible student, good learner.
Same here
Same here
I was the opposite. Great test taker; didn't know schidt. These type of exceptions are another reason to use these tests more to evaluate teachers rather than individual students.
Pay them for performance, rather than paying them more on the assumption that more pay will improve performance. It seems like increased funds for schools just bloats the bureaucracy anyways. More administrators has not been the answer.
Neither is squandering megabucks on wacko PC indoctrination. Learn 'em how to make a living & not how to live.
“It has been a source of great pain to me to have met with so many among [my] opponents who had not the liberality to distinguish between political and social opposition; who transferred at once to the person, the hatred they bore to his political opinions.” —Thomas Jefferson (1808)
t mobile customer? stay alert, "The data includes social security numbers, phone numbers, names, physical addresses, unique IMEI numbers, and driver licenses information, the seller said."
A Wisconsin woman was playing with her catr. Cat was chasing a laser. Laser was the sight of her pistol. Pistol went off. Shot her friend in the thigh.
See, this is why we can't have nice things.
“It has been a source of great pain to me to have met with so many among [my] opponents who had not the liberality to distinguish between political and social opposition; who transferred at once to the person, the hatred they bore to his political opinions.” —Thomas Jefferson (1808)
Walmart and McDonalds, that's the ticket. They'll be waddling around in a stupor in no time.
WARNING: The above post may contain thoughts or ideas known to the State of Caliphornia to cause seething rage, confusion, distemper, nausea, perspiration, sphincter release, or cranial implosion to persons who implicitly trust only one news source, or find themselves at either the left or right political extreme. Proceed at your own risk.
"If you do not read the newspapers you're uninformed. If you do read the newspapers, you're misinformed." -- Mark Twain
@webmost said:
A Wisconsin woman was playing with her catr. Cat was chasing a laser. Laser was the sight of her pistol. Pistol went off. Shot her friend in the thigh.
See, this is why we can't have nice things.
You’re right. The moral of the story is don’t own cats.
f you're a go-getter and a self-starter who likes a challenge in the workplace, the United Nations has a great job opportunity in a dynamic and rapidly changing Middle Eastern country:
The job? "Advancing gender equality and women's empowerment in Afghanistan."
“It has been a source of great pain to me to have met with so many among [my] opponents who had not the liberality to distinguish between political and social opposition; who transferred at once to the person, the hatred they bore to his political opinions.” —Thomas Jefferson (1808)
“It has been a source of great pain to me to have met with so many among [my] opponents who had not the liberality to distinguish between political and social opposition; who transferred at once to the person, the hatred they bore to his political opinions.” —Thomas Jefferson (1808)
Comments
slippin' into darkness er, ad hominem folks.
>
Kids get better grades in private school, at least around here, because the parents are paying for their education and the principal's pressure teachers to change grades, not that this doesn't happen in public schools too but at least there you have a leg to stand on regarding the integrity of your gradebook.
Well, you know, when you spot a trend...we'll miss you, Frank.
"If you do not read the newspapers you're uninformed. If you do read the newspapers, you're misinformed." -- Mark Twain
Liar! 😆
In case the point got missed.
Much of what Frank has said about the problems with the standardized approach is quite correct, I think, but there are also some good reasons for standardized tests. Are they all good? No, I don't think so. So, the point made above is obvious, making sure that kids all across the country have certain basic knowledge and skills.
What can we agree on? How about that we should continually evaluate education? We should consider other approaches, etc., that might improve outcomes, and these may be other than standardized tests. I'm good with considering that.
One idea I had, long ago, was to divide the 12 year system into 4 blocks. First, second, third grade and so forth. The idea here will be that kids develop differently sometimes. So, going into the 4th grade, say, let the kid take classes that he's interested in, save the ones he's not quite ready for until later in the block.
But, I'm wandering from the point. How about another thing we might agree on, that the purpose of schooling should be to prepare the students for real life after their mandatory 12 years. I know, it's not exactly mandatory, but you should get my meaning here.
So, after High School graduation, what then? College? Hmm, they're going to require some things, like the ACT or SAT, standardized tests. What if they go to college and study something like Nursing? You have to pass the NCLEX to get your license. Standardized test. How about Med School? GMAT. Law School? LSAT.
Perhaps a standardized test along the way, say, to graduate High School might help?
Or, what's the better idea?
"If you do not read the newspapers you're uninformed. If you do read the newspapers, you're misinformed." -- Mark Twain
College is so over rated..
Don't let the wife know what you spend on guns, ammo or cigars.
They are thank God
@Amos_Umwhat there's a lot to unpack here. Let me try:
Standardized tests were a byproduct of anecdotal evidence that illiterate students were receiving high school diplomas. Then we tied funding to them, which make them much worse and much less accurate of an assessment. It was the opposite of a bandaid on bullet hole. It was a tourniquet on a paper cut. Now instead of getting a high school diploma, these illiterate kids are getting certificates of attendance. We didn't solve the problem. We just identified it. In many ways, we made it worse.
Continually evaluating education as a great idea, but unfortunately we don't know how to do that. We don't know what measures to use and how to apply them. We don't know how to test for outliers. We don't know how to address identified problems. I'm all ears when it comes to ideas. But big government butting into local government business is not the answer. Look, I'm conservative now!
Your division is an interesting idea. Few flaws though. I'm not criticizing, by the way. First, there are 13 grades not 12. Second, who says 12 grades is the right answer? I know everybody does, but that doesn't mean it's right. Third, schools are divided into specialties of teaching and kids who are like each other. We took ninth grade out of "junior high" and invented middle schools because 6th graders were more like 8th graders than 7th were 9th. K through 3 is defined as early childhood education, which is a specialty of education in many states. There's a lot of psychological, physiological, and developmental data to support this theory. K through 5 is the way it is because you have all prepubescent children as a population. If you start mixing populations, you may introduce unintended problems.
As the parent of 2 current 6th graders and an 8th grader, I can tell you that 5 6 7 and 8 graders in the same school is a problem for the young ones. Plus, you have already built schools for specific populations and you might overcrowd some and leave others underpopulated. That ship has probably sailed, pragmatically.
There's a myth that Bernie Sanders and the left is perpetuating. That myth is that college is for everybody. Wrong. As a college instructor married to a tenured professor, I can tell you that nothing could be further from the truth. Look, still conservative!
Sure you have your SAT and ACT, beacons of light in the standardized testing world. Know why those work and Tony's HS reading test don't? There are 20 reasons, but the top reason is that the test creating organizations ACT and ETS, are private entities that rely on their reputations amongst academia to continue to make money for their shareholders. When the test becomes irrelevant, colleges stop considering those scores, and the tests die.
Yes, all kinds of tests are required for all kinds of professions. You forgot that teachers have to take the praxis. Of course, they have 2 years of teaching before they have to even TAKE the praxis, then they get like 4 shots at passing it. Difference is that they're all academics AND adults.
Way different than a test to get a diploma from a system that failed you for 13 years. Kids don't learn to read and multiply in high school (okay, maybe "multiply" lol).
That's my starting point. We can argue from there.
Not so much to unpack, really...
Agreed. You've elaborated on one of the things I was referring to when I said I thought you were right about many problems with the mandated test.
I thought this was the question I was asking, perhaps I wasn't clear.
I figured Kindergarten to simply stay Kindergarten. In Alaska, I was in a "Junior HS" with 7th - 9th graders. The next year I was in a 5th - 8th grade "middle school". I'm familiar with the problems, which is probably what spawned my idea of 4 divisions after Kindergarten.
Yeah, as above, there's a problem. Societal direction would have to change.
You may have read my comments on this before. I've said many times that many kids should not be going to college. They're not ready. I used my time as an Army recruiter trying to get that across to many parents. "Your son/daughter may one day do well in college, but right now all they'll accomplish is changing beer into urine." As tactfully as possible.
Good idea. Independent entities competing to provide standards that are meaningful. Perhaps these should be employed in creating the H.S. graduation tests.
I didn't forget that, it was never meant to be a comprehensive list, just enough information for the idea to be clearly understood.
Again, agreed.
"If you do not read the newspapers you're uninformed. If you do read the newspapers, you're misinformed." -- Mark Twain
So what are the answers Frank?
When you have kids come out of high school and it takes them 20 minutes to do simple equations for a tape measurer, let alone attempt any kinds of general calculations that are required in most trades.
How do you propose to fix the problem?
When you see people posting on Fakebook, who are in their mid 20s and quite a few can't spell or construct simple sentences with correct grammar, something is very wrong.
What exactly does this mean?
Is it some attempt at a dig on my intelligence?
Money can't buy happiness, but it can buy cigars and that's close enough.
Oh for chrissake Tony, I wasn't digging at your intelligence. I was referring to the story from YOUR state that YOU posted, hence "Tony's." I think that everyone else who read that had zero inclination that I was digging on your intelligence.
If you're that defensive that you search phrases to find something offensive, then I don't know how we can have a conversation.
You ask how to solve your (as in you brought it up just now, not as in you're not intelligent) problem of the tape measure, but you (Oregon, not your intelligence) had the test last year and for the 30 years before and your (Oregon) people can't measure after 30 years of exit testing, so clearly the test didn't get you (Oregon) to where you (tony) wanted to be.
This, by the way, is called "coming full circle" because it's the very first point made to start this whole thing. And guess what? You proved it.
Hmm. Ok.
Again, you didn't answer the question.
You find flaws in all of it, but offer no correction.
You'd make a terrible mechanic.
How can you determine adequate learning without some form of testing?
In work environments, some testing is hands on, which shows competent work.
Can't do that with schooling.
I know, what is my suggestion.
I'm not a school teacher, so I won't even offer suggestions. You'd find them wrong anyways.
I'd put the smilies and stuff, but you made it clear I wasn't using them as intended.
Money can't buy happiness, but it can buy cigars and that's close enough.
Hahahaha I almost inhaled my padron!
I think where we are disconnected is vocabulary. Yes, tests should be a part of education. We are on the same page there.
But the end of high school, all encompassing test is a waste of time to me. That's the test I'd like to get rid of.
Just that one.
I do have solutions to propose, but they're not easy or cheap. I can share them:
Let's see where those 5 get us, then we'll talk about an exit exam.
And I'm a terrible mechanic. 😉
@VegasFrank
Well done, my friend.
I cannot find flaw in any of those points.
I graduated early, with all my requirements done, as I turned 17.
There were several organizations that were instrumental in making that happen. Tests were just that. Stepping stones to change a poor kid's life.
So I cannot say they had been a waste of time for me. It was a complicated web. 🤣
Money can't buy happiness, but it can buy cigars and that's close enough.
I had the "credits" required for graduation at the end of my junior year, but it was against policy to actually let me out of school. So my senior year was Band, three shop classes, a vocational class(VICA?) , then got out to work for 1/2 a day.
Don't let the wife know what you spend on guns, ammo or cigars.
i graduated with a D- average and high SATs. Terrible student, good learner.
Same here
"If you do not read the newspapers you're uninformed. If you do read the newspapers, you're misinformed." -- Mark Twain
Same here
I know, You're a big dog and I'm on the list.
Let's eat, GrandMa. / Let's eat GrandMa. -- Punctuation saves lives
It'll be fine once the swelling goes down.
I was the opposite. Great test taker; didn't know schidt. These type of exceptions are another reason to use these tests more to evaluate teachers rather than individual students.
Pay them for performance, rather than paying them more on the assumption that more pay will improve performance. It seems like increased funds for schools just bloats the bureaucracy anyways. More administrators has not been the answer.
Neither is squandering megabucks on wacko PC indoctrination. Learn 'em how to make a living & not how to live.
t mobile customer? stay alert, "The data includes social security numbers, phone numbers, names, physical addresses, unique IMEI numbers, and driver licenses information, the seller said."
https://www.vice.com/en/article/akg8wg/tmobile-investigating-customer-data-breach-100-million
A Wisconsin woman was playing with her catr. Cat was chasing a laser. Laser was the sight of her pistol. Pistol went off. Shot her friend in the thigh.
See, this is why we can't have nice things.
See they’re just misunderstood. We can beat them with westernization. Add a Superman rollercoaster and fried Twinkie booth
Walmart and McDonalds, that's the ticket. They'll be waddling around in a stupor in no time.
"If you do not read the newspapers you're uninformed. If you do read the newspapers, you're misinformed." -- Mark Twain
You’re right. The moral of the story is don’t own cats.
f you're a go-getter and a self-starter who likes a challenge in the workplace, the United Nations has a great job opportunity in a dynamic and rapidly changing Middle Eastern country:
https://jobs.undp.org/cj_view_job.cfm?cur_job_id=100728
The job? "Advancing gender equality and women's empowerment in Afghanistan."
Well...we did give them a shitton of money for gender studies 🙄
Toxic Masculinity:
Good work by that guy. We really need to make those **** things extinct.
Trapped in the People's Communist Republic of Massachusetts.
Have you been wronged by an alligator Shawn?