@Patrickbrick said:
If you honestly believe that we will not pay for this (all of the “freebies” from this pandemic) down the road I have beach front property to sell you in northern Illinois. Nothing is free, the “government” paid, and paid a lot. The government is beyond broke, we will get the shoulder tap when the bill is due. Middle class always does, rinse, wash, repeat.
As far as cogent arguments against getting the vaccine, I have yet to see one. Not saying it doesn't exist, anything's possible, but it certainly doesn't look like it from what we know now.
Your missing the whole point. Some people, a lot of people believe that a vaccine is not needed to battle a virus that A. Has an extremely low fatality rate and B. Natural immunity works far better. So it comes down to personal choice. Again I am not anti Vax or pro Vax. I am for personal freedoms and choice. I dont have to get a vaccine to protect the ones who are vaccined. If that was the case why the f*ck would anyone get the vaccine.
"I drink a great deal. I sleep a little, and I smoke cigar after cigar. That is why I am in two-hundred-percent form." -- Winston Churchill "LET'S GO FRANCIS" Peter
@Rob1110 said:
For everyone making the "these experimental, unapproved drugs are cheap and that's why the government doesn't want you taking them" argument, I paid exactly zero dollars for my vaccination. Pretty sure that's the going rate. If anyone has paid more than zero dollars, please let us know.
If that's the case, why would government want you to take a "more expensive" vaccine that they're paying for, over a cheap drug that you're willing to shell out your hard earned money for? Even if it's $0.60, that's still more than $0.00. If you're so anti-government, wouldn't you want to take their money? It's about time they give back, right?
Tax dollars, everybody that actually pays them, paid for your vaccination, same as the one I got. Still no free lunch.
Yeah, but your effective tax rate in a given bracket hasn't increased since trump reformed taxes in 2017/2818. We just print the money, add it to the deficit, and hope our kids pay for it someday...so nobody has actually paid for a vaccine with cash out of their pockets.
Disclaimer: All trolling is provided for the sole entertainment purposes of the author only. Readers may find entertainment and hard core truths, but none are intended. Any resulting damaged feelings or arse chapping of the reader are the sole responsibility of the reader, to include, but not limited to: crying, anger, revenge pørn, and abandonment or deletion of ccom accounts. Offer void in Utah because Utah is terrible.
@Rob1110 said:
For everyone making the "these experimental, unapproved drugs are cheap and that's why the government doesn't want you taking them" argument, I paid exactly zero dollars for my vaccination. Pretty sure that's the going rate. If anyone has paid more than zero dollars, please let us know.
If that's the case, why would government want you to take a "more expensive" vaccine that they're paying for, over a cheap drug that you're willing to shell out your hard earned money for? Even if it's $0.60, that's still more than $0.00. If you're so anti-government, wouldn't you want to take their money? It's about time they give back, right?
Tax dollars, everybody that actually pays them, paid for your vaccination, same as the one I got. Still no free lunch.
Yeah, but your effective tax rate in a given bracket hasn't increased since trump reformed taxes in 2017/2818. We just print the money, add it to the deficit, and hope our kids pay for it someday...so nobody has actually paid for a vaccine with cash out of their pockets.
Hence the inflation rates driving up costs. So we are paying either way
"I drink a great deal. I sleep a little, and I smoke cigar after cigar. That is why I am in two-hundred-percent form." -- Winston Churchill "LET'S GO FRANCIS" Peter
@Rob1110 said:
For everyone making the "these experimental, unapproved drugs are cheap and that's why the government doesn't want you taking them" argument, I paid exactly zero dollars for my vaccination. Pretty sure that's the going rate. If anyone has paid more than zero dollars, please let us know.
If that's the case, why would government want you to take a "more expensive" vaccine that they're paying for, over a cheap drug that you're willing to shell out your hard earned money for? Even if it's $0.60, that's still more than $0.00. If you're so anti-government, wouldn't you want to take their money? It's about time they give back, right?
Tax dollars, everybody that actually pays them, paid for your vaccination, same as the one I got. Still no free lunch.
Yeah, but your effective tax rate in a given bracket hasn't increased since trump reformed taxes in 2017/2818. We just print the money, add it to the deficit, and hope our kids pay for it someday...so nobody has actually paid for a vaccine with cash out of their pockets.
Hence the inflation rates driving up costs. So we are paying either way
It was going up either way, with either president. We would be paying for a shot or paying for something else. Zero difference.
Disclaimer: All trolling is provided for the sole entertainment purposes of the author only. Readers may find entertainment and hard core truths, but none are intended. Any resulting damaged feelings or arse chapping of the reader are the sole responsibility of the reader, to include, but not limited to: crying, anger, revenge pørn, and abandonment or deletion of ccom accounts. Offer void in Utah because Utah is terrible.
As far as cogent arguments against getting the vaccine, I have yet to see one. Not saying it doesn't exist, anything's possible, but it certainly doesn't look like it from what we know now.
Your missing the whole point. Some people, a lot of people believe that a vaccine is not needed to battle a virus that A. Has an extremely low fatality rate and B. Natural immunity works far better. So it comes down to personal choice. Again I am not anti Vax or pro Vax. I am for personal freedoms and choice. I dont have to get a vaccine to protect the ones who are vaccined. If that was the case why the f*ck would anyone get the vaccine.
Honest question. We have been studying this form of the virus for a little over a year plus….. how do we know and where is the evidence to support the claim that natural immunity is better for “this” virus. We have vaccines for many many things (virus, disease, etc) that are much better then natural immunity. Where is the proof that in this case we are better off with out a vaccine?
As far as cogent arguments against getting the vaccine, I have yet to see one. Not saying it doesn't exist, anything's possible, but it certainly doesn't look like it from what we know now.
Your missing the whole point. Some people, a lot of people believe that a vaccine is not needed to battle a virus that A. Has an extremely low fatality rate and B. Natural immunity works far better. So it comes down to personal choice. Again I am not anti Vax or pro Vax. I am for personal freedoms and choice. I dont have to get a vaccine to protect the ones who are vaccined. If that was the case why the f*ck would anyone get the vaccine.
Oh I get that, believe me. I know many people who've put forth that argument, including one who's on a ventilator down in Jackson right this very second, a couple who went through that and survived, and I know of some family members of friends who didn't. "It's not 100% fatal" only works until it kills you. Then it was 100% fatal, for you.
WARNING: The above post may contain thoughts or ideas known to the State of Caliphornia to cause seething rage, confusion, distemper, nausea, perspiration, sphincter release, or cranial implosion to persons who implicitly trust only one news source, or find themselves at either the left or right political extreme. Proceed at your own risk.
"If you do not read the newspapers you're uninformed. If you do read the newspapers, you're misinformed." -- Mark Twain
@peter4jc said:
Steve, I apologize for not reading your post in the knowledge of who you are.
This may be Peters way of saying "Oh crap, I opened the valve on the windbag again."
But, I appreciate the kind thought, nonetheless.
WARNING: The above post may contain thoughts or ideas known to the State of Caliphornia to cause seething rage, confusion, distemper, nausea, perspiration, sphincter release, or cranial implosion to persons who implicitly trust only one news source, or find themselves at either the left or right political extreme. Proceed at your own risk.
"If you do not read the newspapers you're uninformed. If you do read the newspapers, you're misinformed." -- Mark Twain
"I drink a great deal. I sleep a little, and I smoke cigar after cigar. That is why I am in two-hundred-percent form." -- Winston Churchill "LET'S GO FRANCIS" Peter
As far as cogent arguments against getting the vaccine, I have yet to see one. Not saying it doesn't exist, anything's possible, but it certainly doesn't look like it from what we know now.
Your missing the whole point. Some people, a lot of people believe that a vaccine is not needed to battle a virus that A. Has an extremely low fatality rate and B. Natural immunity works far better. So it comes down to personal choice. Again I am not anti Vax or pro Vax. I am for personal freedoms and choice. I dont have to get a vaccine to protect the ones who are vaccined. If that was the case why the f*ck would anyone get the vaccine.
Honest question. We have been studying this form of the virus for a little over a year plus….. how do we know and where is the evidence to support the claim that natural immunity is better for “this” virus. We have vaccines for many many things (virus, disease, etc) that are much better then natural immunity. Where is the proof that in this case we are better off with out a vaccine?
Folks I used to work with tell me they're tired of watching 30 - -40 year-old patients die. All the rooms are full, all the ventilators are in use, they're getting in people with heart attacks that need to be sent somewhere, but there's nowhere to send them. I live about 20 miles from Henry County, which is currently #1 in the U.S. for Covid cases, #2 in the world. Is it because over 60% of the population believe all the same hhorsesshit arguments I see here? I don't know. What I do know is that the State people say that >95% of those patients on ventilators are not vaccinated.
Your freedom isn't free. It's costing lives. Are you prepared to lay yours down? For the "freedom" to not get a vaccine that's been proven safe literally hundreds of millions of times?
Ooh, an ouchie! I'm afraid of shots. Wah, wah. I suppose you could ask those who made those decisions, but they can't answer. They're on ventilators.
SMDH
WARNING: The above post may contain thoughts or ideas known to the State of Caliphornia to cause seething rage, confusion, distemper, nausea, perspiration, sphincter release, or cranial implosion to persons who implicitly trust only one news source, or find themselves at either the left or right political extreme. Proceed at your own risk.
"If you do not read the newspapers you're uninformed. If you do read the newspapers, you're misinformed." -- Mark Twain
I get personal choice/freedoms. I don't get the logic behind this choice.
Anti-vaxers: "I'm not putting this vaccine in my body. I don't know what's in it and it was developed WAY too quickly. I just don't trust it."
Also anti-vaxers when they get sick: "Quick, I need some of those monoclonal antibodies that were developed in even less time than the vaccine but I feel completely informed and know exactly everything I need to know to totally trust doctors and scientists for this treatment."
For the record, mAb (monoclonal antibody) treatment involves taking antibodies from other patients who are recovering or have recently recovered, replicating them, synthetically (because that's always an argument from the anti-vax side) and placing them into your body to fight the infection in place of your own immune system. This also means there is a greatly reduced chance that you will build any natural immunity after recovery if this treatment is used. This mAb therapy to Covid was developed in 10 months, is relatively new technology (mAb therapies were pioneered in the late 80s, so this is very new technology, much like mRNA, according to vaccine skeptics - subsequently, mRNA was discovered and studied as far back as the 60s) and has the dreaded FDA Emergency Use Authorization approval.
Anti-vaxers: "I'm not making some jerk at some big pharma (Pfizer or Moderna) rich by getting the very inexpensive vaccine."
Also anti-vaxers when they get sick: "Can I have some of that much more expensive monoclonal antibody treatment? I'm not giving my money to big pharma.....unless it's Regeneron. They're ok. I'll make them rich."
That's what I don't understand. Maybe it's me. Maybe I'm approaching this all to logically and not emotionally enough. I'm trying to wrap my head around it and understand why, at this point, with everything going on: the state of the economy and the need/desire to reopen; the fact that this virus is now killing children; now that millions of people have been vaccinated and the data that shows it's the unvaccinated that are taking up hospital beds and dying; in spite of all of it, people still continue on their crusades against getting vaccinated. I'd honestly like to understand it without someone getting angry and throwing insults around or flying off the handle. I'd like to see some of the scientific data supporting the sentiment behind not getting vaccinated.
Thanks for that, Dave. I needed it. I keep telling myself to bow out, but I know too many who are too close, and I fall in the category of someone who may NEED the hospital system and it won't be there, for me, because a bunch of dumbasses are exercising their freedom to be stupid. Sigh.
Two quotes keep coming to mind:
"Stupid is as stupid does." Forrest Gump's Mama
"You can't fix stupid." Ron White
OK, I'm going to try and be done now.
WARNING: The above post may contain thoughts or ideas known to the State of Caliphornia to cause seething rage, confusion, distemper, nausea, perspiration, sphincter release, or cranial implosion to persons who implicitly trust only one news source, or find themselves at either the left or right political extreme. Proceed at your own risk.
"If you do not read the newspapers you're uninformed. If you do read the newspapers, you're misinformed." -- Mark Twain
I get personal choice/freedoms. I don't get the logic behind this choice.
Anti-vaxers: "I'm not putting this vaccine in my body. I don't know what's in it and it was developed WAY too quickly. I just don't trust it."
Also anti-vaxers when they get sick: "Quick, I need some of those monoclonal antibodies that were developed in even less time than the vaccine but I feel completely informed and know exactly everything I need to know to totally trust doctors and scientists for this treatment."
For the record, mAb (monoclonal antibody) treatment involves taking antibodies from other patients who are recovering or have recently recovered, replicating them, synthetically (because that's always an argument from the anti-vax side) and placing them into your body to fight the infection in place of your own immune system. This also means there is a greatly reduced chance that you will build any natural immunity after recovery if this treatment is used. This mAb therapy to Covid was developed in 10 months, is relatively new technology (mAb therapies were pioneered in the late 80s, so this is very new technology, much like mRNA, according to vaccine skeptics - subsequently, mRNA was discovered and studied as far back as the 60s) and has the dreaded FDA Emergency Use Authorization approval.
Anti-vaxers: "I'm not making some jerk at some big pharma (Pfizer or Moderna) rich by getting the very inexpensive vaccine."
Also anti-vaxers when they get sick: "Can I have some of that much more expensive monoclonal antibody treatment? I'm not giving my money to big pharma.....unless it's Regeneron. They're ok. I'll make them rich."
That's what I don't understand. Maybe it's me. Maybe I'm approaching this all to logically and not emotionally enough. I'm trying to wrap my head around it and understand why, at this point, with everything going on: the state of the economy and the need/desire to reopen; the fact that this virus is now killing children; now that millions of people have been vaccinated and the data that shows it's the unvaccinated that are taking up hospital beds and dying; in spite of all of it, people still continue on their crusades against getting vaccinated. I'd honestly like to understand it without someone getting angry and throwing insults around or flying off the handle. I'd like to see some of the scientific data supporting the sentiment behind not getting vaccinated.
Because the majority of people like myself who got covid are just fine. So therefore, it is my personal choice. I dont know why that is so confusing.
"I drink a great deal. I sleep a little, and I smoke cigar after cigar. That is why I am in two-hundred-percent form." -- Winston Churchill "LET'S GO FRANCIS" Peter
Also anti-vaxers when they get sick: "Quick, I need some of those monoclonal antibodies that were developed in even less time than the vaccine but I feel completely informed and know exactly everything I need to know to totally trust doctors and scientists for this treatment."
I didnt get antibody treatment so that's a false assumption.
"Can I the state of the economy and the need/desire to reopen;
I dont know what commie state you live in but here in Florida we been open.
"I drink a great deal. I sleep a little, and I smoke cigar after cigar. That is why I am in two-hundred-percent form." -- Winston Churchill "LET'S GO FRANCIS" Peter
Do you actually smoke cigars or just come here for this thread? Just wondering.
"I drink a great deal. I sleep a little, and I smoke cigar after cigar. That is why I am in two-hundred-percent form." -- Winston Churchill "LET'S GO FRANCIS" Peter
Estimates are that 1/3 of the US population has had Covid, and has natural immunity. Data comes from the Red Cross, blood testing for antibodies. Another 55-60% are fully or partially vaccinated. So it seems to me that only 10-15% of the population is at serious risk, yet cases are up 300% from this time last year. Things don't add up and I'm not anti vax.
Don't let the wife know what you spend on guns, ammo or cigars.
Do you actually smoke cigars or just come here for this thread? Just wondering.
I'm flattered at your interest in my personal life, so yes, I do smoke cigars. I've been a member of this forum since 2008. How long have you been a member? Granted, I did take some time off, for no particular reason, so I may not have been around when you joined.
"Because the majority of people like myself who got covid are just fine. So therefore, it is my personal choice. I dont know why that is so confusing."
So you're saying that it's purely for emotionally based, selfish reasons? Again, I'm simply trying to understand why grown adults are so adamant about their rights and freedoms, when the choices they're making could potentially be putting others around them at risk.
Picture this: you're going out to eat with some friends and Bill doesn't want to put his shoes on but the restaurant won't allow Bill in without his shoes. No shirt, no shoes, no service. Do you side with Bill and yell at the restaurant that "it's Bill's right to go barefoot if he wants!" or maybe try to reason with Bill about why he refuses to wear shoes? How long do you try to reason with him before you get frustrated? When you ask Bill why he refuses to wear shoes, his only argument is "because I don't want to."
How is it selfish. Help me understand. I need to get vaxxed to protect who exactly?
And I dont care about your personal life but you are on a cigar forum and strictly post about corona virus. Wouldnt a corona virus forum suit you more since this is your passion?
Also, your analogy made zero sense. So you got that going for you.... which is nice
"I drink a great deal. I sleep a little, and I smoke cigar after cigar. That is why I am in two-hundred-percent form." -- Winston Churchill "LET'S GO FRANCIS" Peter
It's selfish for all of the reasons that have already been listed here. You're protecting the people close to you, those that you interact with every day, those that you work with, those that you may pass by. You're helping by not potentially contributing to the already overflowing network of hospitals (remember, it may not be you that ends up in the hospital but someone you unintentionally infect), so that when someone does get in a car accident or have a heart attack or any other reason for going to a hospital, they're able to get treatment.
It's quite fine that you don't care about my personal life. I've posted in a few other spots on this forum as well but this seems to be the place where you tend to notice me the most. I'm not sure of any corona virus forums but I wouldn't call it a "passion," though science has always been a passion of mine.
Today's despicable person: The owner of a Texas restaurant about 20 miles northeast of Dallas who threw out a young couple who were on a rare night out with friends.
Were they kicked out because they were drunk, unruly, or rude? Nope. They were shown the door because they had the audacity to wear masks.
That's right: The owner has a no-mask policy.
Each of the young parents wears a mask whenever they leave the house because their 4-month-old son has cystic fibrosis -- a serious disease of the lungs and digestive system. Their waitress didn't care. She closed out their tab and sent them on their way.
Today's despicable person: The owner of a Texas restaurant about 20 miles northeast of Dallas who threw out a young couple who were on a rare night out with friends.
Were they kicked out because they were drunk, unruly, or rude? Nope. They were shown the door because they had the audacity to wear masks.
That's right: The owner has a no-mask policy.
Each of the young parents wears a mask whenever they leave the house because their 4-month-old son has cystic fibrosis -- a serious disease of the lungs and digestive system. Their waitress didn't care. She closed out their tab and sent them on their way.
For the last time… People who locked themselves inside and relied on the vaccine are now getting sick because Delta doesn’t give a crap. People who caught an earlier variant are not catching it. Also, people who are vaccinated still spread Covid. If anything they are more dangerous because they don’t know when they are sick. Stop spouting bullshit about people who don’t get vaccinated not caring who they infect. It’s unreasonable, counter productive, and it makes you part of the problem.
"Cooking isn't about struggling; It's about pleasure. It's like sǝx, with a wider variety of sauces."
At any given time the urge to sing "In The Jungle" is just a whim away... A whim away... A whim away...
@Rob1110 said:
It's selfish for all of the reasons that have already been listed here. You're protecting the people close to you, those that you interact with every day, those that you work with, those that you may pass by. You're helping by not potentially contributing to the already overflowing network of hospitals (remember, it may not be you that ends up in the hospital but someone you unintentionally infect), so that when someone does get in a car accident or have a heart attack or any other reason for going to a hospital, they're able to get treatment.
It's quite fine that you don't care about my personal life. I've posted in a few other spots on this forum as well but this seems to be the place where you tend to notice me the most. I'm not sure of any corona virus forums but I wouldn't call it a "passion," though science has always been a passion of mine.
My family has already had covid and surprisingly they survived. I know it's crazy right. They also didn't get an antibody treatment. Its a miracle, I know. So again, if everyone is vaxxed then why do I have to protect them? If I do, why get vaxxed. And if they aren't vaxxed then are just an anti-vaxxer right and its ok if they die. Thats what you guys are saying right. So guess what, I dont care if you dont understand a person's personal choice. I dont care if you think its selfish. Fùck it, ill be selfish.
"I drink a great deal. I sleep a little, and I smoke cigar after cigar. That is why I am in two-hundred-percent form." -- Winston Churchill "LET'S GO FRANCIS" Peter
I will never understand why they push the rhetoric of only the non-vaccinated are spreading it. If you can get it you can spread it, its that simple and the vaccinated are still getting it so there's that.
"We make a living by what we get, but we make a life by what we give". Winston Churchill. MOW badge received.
Comments
Steve, I apologize for not reading your post in the knowledge of who you are.
How much for mom
Your missing the whole point. Some people, a lot of people believe that a vaccine is not needed to battle a virus that A. Has an extremely low fatality rate and B. Natural immunity works far better. So it comes down to personal choice. Again I am not anti Vax or pro Vax. I am for personal freedoms and choice. I dont have to get a vaccine to protect the ones who are vaccined. If that was the case why the f*ck would anyone get the vaccine.
-- Winston Churchill
"LET'S GO FRANCIS" Peter
Yeah, but your effective tax rate in a given bracket hasn't increased since trump reformed taxes in 2017/2818. We just print the money, add it to the deficit, and hope our kids pay for it someday...so nobody has actually paid for a vaccine with cash out of their pockets.
Hence the inflation rates driving up costs. So we are paying either way
-- Winston Churchill
"LET'S GO FRANCIS" Peter
It was going up either way, with either president. We would be paying for a shot or paying for something else. Zero difference.
Honest question. We have been studying this form of the virus for a little over a year plus….. how do we know and where is the evidence to support the claim that natural immunity is better for “this” virus. We have vaccines for many many things (virus, disease, etc) that are much better then natural immunity. Where is the proof that in this case we are better off with out a vaccine?
Edit: grammar
Oh I get that, believe me. I know many people who've put forth that argument, including one who's on a ventilator down in Jackson right this very second, a couple who went through that and survived, and I know of some family members of friends who didn't. "It's not 100% fatal" only works until it kills you. Then it was 100% fatal, for you.
"If you do not read the newspapers you're uninformed. If you do read the newspapers, you're misinformed." -- Mark Twain
This may be Peters way of saying "Oh crap, I opened the valve on the windbag again."
But, I appreciate the kind thought, nonetheless.
"If you do not read the newspapers you're uninformed. If you do read the newspapers, you're misinformed." -- Mark Twain
https://www.nytimes.com/2021/09/18/health/covid-antibody-regeneron.html
I still don't get it.
You dont get personal choice/ freedoms?
-- Winston Churchill
"LET'S GO FRANCIS" Peter
The Israeli's studied it a bit,
https://www.westernjournal.com/massive-israeli-study-comes-bombshell-conclusion-natural-covid-immunity/
Folks I used to work with tell me they're tired of watching 30 - -40 year-old patients die. All the rooms are full, all the ventilators are in use, they're getting in people with heart attacks that need to be sent somewhere, but there's nowhere to send them. I live about 20 miles from Henry County, which is currently #1 in the U.S. for Covid cases, #2 in the world. Is it because over 60% of the population believe all the same hhorsesshit arguments I see here? I don't know. What I do know is that the State people say that >95% of those patients on ventilators are not vaccinated.
Your freedom isn't free. It's costing lives. Are you prepared to lay yours down? For the "freedom" to not get a vaccine that's been proven safe literally hundreds of millions of times?
Ooh, an ouchie! I'm afraid of shots. Wah, wah. I suppose you could ask those who made those decisions, but they can't answer. They're on ventilators.
SMDH
"If you do not read the newspapers you're uninformed. If you do read the newspapers, you're misinformed." -- Mark Twain
I get personal choice/freedoms. I don't get the logic behind this choice.
Anti-vaxers: "I'm not putting this vaccine in my body. I don't know what's in it and it was developed WAY too quickly. I just don't trust it."
Also anti-vaxers when they get sick: "Quick, I need some of those monoclonal antibodies that were developed in even less time than the vaccine but I feel completely informed and know exactly everything I need to know to totally trust doctors and scientists for this treatment."
For the record, mAb (monoclonal antibody) treatment involves taking antibodies from other patients who are recovering or have recently recovered, replicating them, synthetically (because that's always an argument from the anti-vax side) and placing them into your body to fight the infection in place of your own immune system. This also means there is a greatly reduced chance that you will build any natural immunity after recovery if this treatment is used. This mAb therapy to Covid was developed in 10 months, is relatively new technology (mAb therapies were pioneered in the late 80s, so this is very new technology, much like mRNA, according to vaccine skeptics - subsequently, mRNA was discovered and studied as far back as the 60s) and has the dreaded FDA Emergency Use Authorization approval.
Anti-vaxers: "I'm not making some jerk at some big pharma (Pfizer or Moderna) rich by getting the very inexpensive vaccine."
Also anti-vaxers when they get sick: "Can I have some of that much more expensive monoclonal antibody treatment? I'm not giving my money to big pharma.....unless it's Regeneron. They're ok. I'll make them rich."
That's what I don't understand. Maybe it's me. Maybe I'm approaching this all to logically and not emotionally enough. I'm trying to wrap my head around it and understand why, at this point, with everything going on: the state of the economy and the need/desire to reopen; the fact that this virus is now killing children; now that millions of people have been vaccinated and the data that shows it's the unvaccinated that are taking up hospital beds and dying; in spite of all of it, people still continue on their crusades against getting vaccinated. I'd honestly like to understand it without someone getting angry and throwing insults around or flying off the handle. I'd like to see some of the scientific data supporting the sentiment behind not getting vaccinated.
Thanks for that, Dave. I needed it. I keep telling myself to bow out, but I know too many who are too close, and I fall in the category of someone who may NEED the hospital system and it won't be there, for me, because a bunch of dumbasses are exercising their freedom to be stupid. Sigh.
Two quotes keep coming to mind:
"Stupid is as stupid does." Forrest Gump's Mama
"You can't fix stupid." Ron White
OK, I'm going to try and be done now.
"If you do not read the newspapers you're uninformed. If you do read the newspapers, you're misinformed." -- Mark Twain
“Never mistake stupidity for courage”.
MOW badge received.
How many times will we read a similar story?
https://www.msn.com/en-us/lifestyle/weddings/unmasked-unmuzzled-unvaccinated-mother-of-four-dies-of-covid/ar-AAODzRv?ocid=entnewsntp
Because the majority of people like myself who got covid are just fine. So therefore, it is my personal choice. I dont know why that is so confusing.
-- Winston Churchill
"LET'S GO FRANCIS" Peter
I didnt get antibody treatment so that's a false assumption.
"Can I the state of the economy and the need/desire to reopen;
I dont know what commie state you live in but here in Florida we been open.
-- Winston Churchill
"LET'S GO FRANCIS" Peter
Do you actually smoke cigars or just come here for this thread? Just wondering.
-- Winston Churchill
"LET'S GO FRANCIS" Peter
Estimates are that 1/3 of the US population has had Covid, and has natural immunity. Data comes from the Red Cross, blood testing for antibodies. Another 55-60% are fully or partially vaccinated. So it seems to me that only 10-15% of the population is at serious risk, yet cases are up 300% from this time last year. Things don't add up and I'm not anti vax.
Don't let the wife know what you spend on guns, ammo or cigars.
I'm flattered at your interest in my personal life, so yes, I do smoke cigars. I've been a member of this forum since 2008. How long have you been a member? Granted, I did take some time off, for no particular reason, so I may not have been around when you joined.
"Because the majority of people like myself who got covid are just fine. So therefore, it is my personal choice. I dont know why that is so confusing."
So you're saying that it's purely for emotionally based, selfish reasons? Again, I'm simply trying to understand why grown adults are so adamant about their rights and freedoms, when the choices they're making could potentially be putting others around them at risk.
Picture this: you're going out to eat with some friends and Bill doesn't want to put his shoes on but the restaurant won't allow Bill in without his shoes. No shirt, no shoes, no service. Do you side with Bill and yell at the restaurant that "it's Bill's right to go barefoot if he wants!" or maybe try to reason with Bill about why he refuses to wear shoes? How long do you try to reason with him before you get frustrated? When you ask Bill why he refuses to wear shoes, his only argument is "because I don't want to."
How is it selfish. Help me understand. I need to get vaxxed to protect who exactly?
And I dont care about your personal life but you are on a cigar forum and strictly post about corona virus. Wouldnt a corona virus forum suit you more since this is your passion?
Also, your analogy made zero sense. So you got that going for you.... which is nice
-- Winston Churchill
"LET'S GO FRANCIS" Peter
It's selfish for all of the reasons that have already been listed here. You're protecting the people close to you, those that you interact with every day, those that you work with, those that you may pass by. You're helping by not potentially contributing to the already overflowing network of hospitals (remember, it may not be you that ends up in the hospital but someone you unintentionally infect), so that when someone does get in a car accident or have a heart attack or any other reason for going to a hospital, they're able to get treatment.
Here, it's explained by the fine folks at Family Guy: https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/family-guy-release-pro-vaccine-psa/ar-AAOFD2d
It's quite fine that you don't care about my personal life. I've posted in a few other spots on this forum as well but this seems to be the place where you tend to notice me the most. I'm not sure of any corona virus forums but I wouldn't call it a "passion," though science has always been a passion of mine.
from the Boston Globe:
Today's despicable person: The owner of a Texas restaurant about 20 miles northeast of Dallas who threw out a young couple who were on a rare night out with friends.
Were they kicked out because they were drunk, unruly, or rude? Nope. They were shown the door because they had the audacity to wear masks.
That's right: The owner has a no-mask policy.
Each of the young parents wears a mask whenever they leave the house because their 4-month-old son has cystic fibrosis -- a serious disease of the lungs and digestive system. Their waitress didn't care. She closed out their tab and sent them on their way.
Just....wow.
For the last time… People who locked themselves inside and relied on the vaccine are now getting sick because Delta doesn’t give a crap. People who caught an earlier variant are not catching it. Also, people who are vaccinated still spread Covid. If anything they are more dangerous because they don’t know when they are sick. Stop spouting bullshit about people who don’t get vaccinated not caring who they infect. It’s unreasonable, counter productive, and it makes you part of the problem.
At any given time the urge to sing "In The Jungle" is just a whim away... A whim away... A whim away...
My family has already had covid and surprisingly they survived. I know it's crazy right. They also didn't get an antibody treatment. Its a miracle, I know. So again, if everyone is vaxxed then why do I have to protect them? If I do, why get vaxxed. And if they aren't vaxxed then are just an anti-vaxxer right and its ok if they die. Thats what you guys are saying right. So guess what, I dont care if you dont understand a person's personal choice. I dont care if you think its selfish. Fùck it, ill be selfish.
-- Winston Churchill
"LET'S GO FRANCIS" Peter
I will never understand why they push the rhetoric of only the non-vaccinated are spreading it. If you can get it you can spread it, its that simple and the vaccinated are still getting it so there's that.
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